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A PERSONAL LETTER TO THOSE PREPARING FOR, OR INVOLVED IN, SHIDUCHIM
By Rabbi Tuvia Teldon, Head Shliach of Long Island and Rabbi Yossi Paltiel, Mashpia and Founder of insidechassidus.org
Recently, a letter was posted on COLlive.com painting Dor Yeshorim organization in a very negative light.
We heard the writer’s pain at having a sick child, and applaud her for attempting to take matters into her own hand by becoming a genetics counselor. However, frankly, her accusations (results take 3-4 months when in fact individual results come in 2-3 weeks), mistruths (that Dor Yeshorim does not test for multiple mutations when in fact – for example – they test for 7 mutations of Tay Sachs and 14 of Cystic Fibrosis) and irresponsible statements (she would rather not be tested at all than to be tested by Dor Yeshorim), are reckless and must be responded to.
Since we both have great respect for Dor Yeshorim, we contacted the founder Rabbi Yoseph Ekstein (who himself lost four children to Tay Sachs before starting the organization over 30 years ago) to get some answers about this crucial issue. We felt it is important to respond with clarity.
This article is based on our past experiences with Dor Yeshorim, our recent conversations with Rabbi Ekstein, and some medical articles.
First of all, we think it is important to make clear what Dor Yeshorim is and what it is not. On their website it clearly states “Dor Yeshorim does not operate simply as a testing center. We are a unique, pre-marital, genetic compatibility program.” In addition, there are actually many labs and testing centers that offer even more tests than jscreen offers. Which scientist or which professional decided that the number should be 106? If you want a report of your complete genetic makeup and every possible disease or disorder, Dor Yeshorim is not offering this service nor does it believe in this!
But before you start running to the door, we think it is imperative that you know a few facts.
Dor Yeshorim is a group of professionals (Rabbi Teldon visited their premises in Brooklyn years ago) who are dedicated to striking a very delicate balance between preventing serious recessive genetic diseases, and encouraging shiduchim without creating any damage for any individual.
On the one hand, they test specifically for the common recessive genes that can create “fatal and debilitating genetic diseases” for Ashkenaz or Sephardic children. They do test for more diseases than those recommended even by the Israeli National Health Dept. as well as many prestigious scientists.
On the other hand, they will not test for every disease just because the test exists (i.e. they do not test for mild diseases or for genes that are not clearly causing disease, and that is with the recommendation of top Geneticists and Rabonim). Many diseases they don’t test for may be chronic, but are manageable. Dor Yeshorim, and their Rabonim, don’t want to play God! They are not looking for needles in a haystack!
But before you insist that nevertheless you want to know all there is to know, let us advise you that according to the American College of Medical Genetics carrier screening guidelines for Jews of Ashkenaz descent, “the proper selection of appropriate disease causing targets for general population based carrier screening should be developed using clear criteria, rather than simply including as many disorders as possible”. “…bigger, for the sake of being bigger, is not better.” Very often additional tests raise more questions than answers. Can you imagine how many of your family and friends may have been deemed ‘incompatible’ with a questionable incompatibility had they tested for over 100 diseases?
True, there are other Genetic Centers you can go to as mentioned before. But be aware that you may learn more about yourself or your prospective date than you want or are prepared to know. How would you decide to go ahead with a great shiduch opportunity when you are both carriers for disease #72, which the frequency or the outcome of the disease is not even well known? If they do get married, can you imagine the insecurity they might live with during every pregnancy because of the very remote chance that their baby could have that rare disorder? What if the ‘other’ family learns of your genetic carrier status, cancels the shiduch, and then ‘somehow’ the word gets out to the ‘other’ family members? And last but not least, if your first date does not work out, after you find out that you are a carrier, how will you convince every future date that they also have to go to outside screeners? What if they don’t want to wait or spend the extra money?
In addition, with other screeners you can date before testing. If after dating there are found to be genetic compatibility issues, the couple will have to deal with a whole new set of problems due to the emotional bonds that may have formed. Many people at that moment in their lives have made foolish decisions and have to live with them for the duration of their lives. Dor Yeshorim takes that stress away by testing before we begin the dating process.
Rabbi Ekstein has taken much criticism for his insistence on early testing and total confidentiality in the Dor Yeshorim process, but by doing so he has spared thousands of us, and our Rabonim, the trials and tribulations of making superhuman, potentially life and death, decisions.
Dor Yeshorim has a clear mission, and in line with well-accepted medical standards, they resist the obvious temptation to test for every possible disease. With that said, they are constantly improving their work, adding new genes and mutations, embarking on innovative genetic-related projects, and raising the bar to better serve Klal Yisroel. But any new disease they take on has to be with the consent and backing of their medical team, Rabonim, and experts in the field of genetics. They take this work very seriously, are well respected in the field, and realize the great responsibility that is resting on their shoulders. Interestingly enough, they do offer additional tests for several rare diseases for specific families who are in a higher risk: tests that Jscreen does not offer at all. Obviously, their form of selecting and deciding what diseases to test is totally different.
Nothing in life is perfect, and we believe it is only the Aibershter who ultimately decides who will be healthy, and who will not. Their duty is to make the maximum hishtadlus while not causing damage at the same time.
Dor Yeshorim does not guarantee 100% – no testing organization can. And when uncommon diseases or untested mutations unfortunately show their ugly face in rare occasions, we see clearly how nothing that a human being does can be perfect.
But the overall security that we all do have that all common “life threatening and seriously debilitating” diseases are not a concern in making a shiduch, is a luxury unique to the frum world, a gift made to Klal Yisroel only 3 decades ago by one man and one organization.
So if you still have doubts about submitting to a Dor Yeshorim test, visit doryeshorim.org, ask questions, and do your own research.
We are hopeful that you will join the over 450,000 other yidden around the world who trust, and are thankful for, the hard work and true daily mesirus nefesh of Rabbi Ekstein and the Dor Yeshorim staff.
I agree that you should test for Dor Yesharim.
I’m also hearing that that DY is providing you with an umbrella that has holes. This article is telling me that those “holes” aren’t life threatening/debilitating and common. What if a couple happens to be carriers for something uncommon (like the previous author) but life risking?
It does seem wise to patch up those “holes” with additional testing.
Dor Yeshorim needs to be more pro-active in the United KIngdom. They do not address the greatest Jewish community .Could Dor Yeshorim send a speaker to the United Kingdom or run articles in the Jewish newspapers please.
Just like your local Chabad house Rabbi doesn’t oversee conversions, or pasken on how a couple would go through infertility treatments, genetics is a very specialized area and a Rabbi without expertise and discussion with qualified MEDICAL experts has no business paskening in this area. I believe DY does follow these types of practice and it is completely a legitimate path to take. HOWEVER, the wider picture is much more complex, and the authors of this article cannot pasken in this area- in fact I will go ahead and say that a psak that depends on very complex medical science… Read more »
I had no idea about the two panel! I really appreciate this married couple who brought things to our attention so my husband and I can now make an INFORMED decision as to how to proceed with our shidduch age children!
The gist of this op-ed is basically saying that dor yesharim has done and does a lot of good. Nobody is denying that! However there is much more than can be done… Yes, this mother writes to warn and make others aware how they can avoid a scenario which she herself encountered!! So yes, because Dor Yesharim failed her!!!
And frankly, 2 rabbis giving their opinions based on nothing is pointless. Perhaps, Dr. Rosen or other Drs can come together to pen an op-ed.
They were carriers for a disease that wasn’t on Dor Yeshorim’s 2nd panel either.
To all those saying that the the author of the previous article was a competing business: That is wrong.
They did contrast Dor Yeshorim with an alternative testing organization – Jscreen, which is not affiliated them.
Jnetic (the previous author’s organization) is simply raising awareness, not asking for any payment.
Cost less and provides more extensive testing so why would one pay more to get less information. Usually when you go to a Dr. You want the most possible available information so you can make the most informed decisions.
DY is under the psak of leading poskim
With all due respect to the two esteemed Rabbis, isn’t it reckless to encourage people to suffice with the DY testing and potentially burden a couple with a lifetime of suffering or even worse Chas Visholom? Are you Paskening as Rabbonim? I would love to see a Psak from our Lubavitcher Rabbonim on this matter as to what is Mutar and what is Asur and what is our Hischayvus in terms of our human Hishtadlus.
I am so sorry for your loss and for all the pain you have had & surely must still have. Yours is the only comment that really matters, although I agree with this article. Dor Yeshorim saves lives and through the efforts of Rabbi Ekstein & his team, G-d willing we will see the eradication of such diseases. To John: all my children were tested, as were their spouses & all, B”H were compatible. I have no idea if any of them are carriers for genetic diseases – what matters is that TOGETHER, each couple is not going to have… Read more »
The more we educate ourselves and our community about potential genetic health risks the more prepared we will be to avoid or deal with them. I truly appreciate both articles because now I know what my choices are. Until now I thought that DY was covering everything that was possible to know through testing (Perhaps my ignorance) now I am informed otherwise and I can decide what level of risk I am willing to accept. I personally would like to do everything in my power to prevent health problems and then Daven to HaShem knowing that I did my very… Read more »
I think there is a lot of confusion. Jnetics is not a lab nor does it offer testing nor is it competing with Dor Yishorim jnetvis is a website that offers information regarding the differences between dor yishorim’s testing and jscreen. If you do DY testing make sure to do both panels. The author of the previous article was unaware of a second panel being offered (most ppl taking DY are not informed that theee are two panels) and unfortunately we’re both carriers for the same genetic disease. This could have easily been avoided if they were made aware of… Read more »
Even if the dor yeshorim model was approved by poskim (chabad??) That doesn’t mean they have any expertise on whether the medical science is there. For that we need to ask the relevant doctors, not poskim
Genetics have changed so much, and although DY does accomplish it’s goal, those of us who deal with genetic issues just can’t see things from the perspective of “doing the most basic for the most people will help the most people”. Some of us found ourselves outside that category. Also, the original author pointed out the options to preventing disease in couples who DY would just not allow to marry. Genetics have gotten a lot more complicated than the authors of this article realize, and patting everyone on the head saying “DY works!” is frankly, patronizing and off putting. I… Read more »
Thanks for posting!
The other article did leave me wondering
Thanks for clarifying
He said that when it comes to Torah questions, we should ask 3 chassidishe rabbonim. But when it comes to health, we should ask doctors: In other words, in addition to that which has been discussed recently concerning the imperative to fulfill the instruction of the Mishnah, “Make for yourself a teacher,”[4] and in matters related to healing, to consult with doctors, according to the statement of our sages on the verse, “And he will surely heal”[5] [“From here we see that a healer is given permission to heal”[6]]. These directives are not related to “Come, let us consider an… Read more »
#15 Dor yesharim is not the cause of the stigma attached to this issue. More it their mission to combat it. It would indeed be a good thing to reduce the signs of being s genetic carrier of serious disease. However, this is something that needs to be taken up by a different organization. In the meantime, Dor yesharim must do what it can to reduce the incidence of these diseases. It is worth noting that the model used by Dor yesharim was essentially mandated by the major Poskim at the time the organization was founded. In the interim, no… Read more »
doesn’t mean that it is not worth to try and prevent
do not undermine the effect of a chronic, “manageable” disease
The person behind the previous article, opened up a competing business. Therefore, whatever they say should have been taken with a grain of salt, since they clearly lack credibility. Thank you Rabbis Paltiel and Teldon for speaking up, and adding clarity to this confused generation.
Thank you.
am so glad you posted this article, My husband and I are both Tay-Sachs carriers we got married before Dor Yeshorim was around, B’H for Dor Yeshorim they have saved countless couples from unbearable grief and heartbreak. I was so agitated when I read the ridiculous claim that it was better to not do Dor Yeshorim because they don’t test for every sickness. My daughter lived in the local children’s hospital for 4 years before she died, the hospital was a huge city block long and 12 stories high and every kid had a different sickness. There are no warranties… Read more »
A nice article and covered a lot of points but the answer on the stigma point has been left unanswered.
They said it’s time to get rid of the stigma of having a mutation by everybody going public. The answer here is let’s keep the stigma going?
Dor Yeshorim and Jnetic are looking at different sides of the coin. Dor Yeshorim works toward eliminating certain devastating genitic disorders, and sparing unnecessary pain and fear. If boy A is cv”s a carrier of Tay Sachs, and girl B is a carrier of CF, they can get married and have kids who will not have either disease. They will never know they are carriers, and will have no genitive worries. Note go to a different lab, and boy C finds out that he is a carrier of something. He is an honest guy and tells girl D his status.… Read more »
Thank you SOOOOOOOOO much for your clarification. While one can hear the pain of the writer of the previous article, it was extemely disconcerting and this clarifies a lot about what dor yeshorim does. Thanks
I was disappointed how easily you printed the first article. Ad I read it was obviously written by a competitor with a financial interest & hence automatically carried an inherent bias anti Direct Yeshorim.
with all respect ,they must give carrier the full info …and made the tests more , over 30 years all science and medicine can give full answer and not be limited for few mutations …..
Dorm yesharim is an amazing organization
I was pretty sure from the other article that the reason for Dor Yeshorim not testing for many genetic mutations was that those illness were not life threatening and had the backing of Rabbonim. Thank you for clarifying.
May Klal Yisroel be bentched with only healthy babies!
Why can’t Dor Yeshorim and Jnetic sit down and talk and let Dor Yeshorim address the concerns they have?
Thanks for the clarity
the other article was very lopsided and irresponsible.
For Dor Yeshorim, Rabbi E, Rabbi Teldon ,Rabbi Paltiel & COL for printing this informative article & for everything you do for klal Yisroel.
A freilichen Chanukah
In the future, before posting any report, letter, op-ed etc. involving the trustworthiness of reputable organizations or people, one should first consult an expert in the field. for medical issues – reputable doctors. for halacha – rabbonim, for chinuch matters – experiened mechanchim. etc. etc.
Because once the bull gets out there it’s very hard to retract it even with writing another letter contradicting and proving how untruthful the posted report was.
Thanks for clarifying!
This article makes so much sense! I will admit… I got a little panicky after reading the letter showing Dor Yeshorim in a negative light!! But BH these two intelligent Rabbonim have totally put my mind at rest. Thank you