Feb 22, 2010
Apology Letter to Mrs. Park

A law student is garnering signatures for an apology letter to Margaret Park, who received 'unkind' phone calls after saying Martin Grossman's execution was "long overdue."

By Aryeh Levin, COLlive reporter

A Jewish law student from Columbus, Ohio, is garnering signatures for an apology letter to Mrs. Margaret Park, mother of slain wildlife officer Peggy Park.

The young Park was shot to death in Florida in 1984 by Martin Grossman, a Jewish man, who took responsibility for the killing before being executed Tuesday, Feb 16, 2010.

Chabad and Jewish organization, and even the Vatican, had asked for clemency, arguing that he had shown remorse.

"I fully regret everything that happened that night, everything that was done, whether I remember everything or not. I accept responsibility," Grossman was recorded as saying.



But Park's 79-year-old mother who lives in suburban Columbus, said: "I think he's been treated very fairly by the state of Florida. I don't take any pleasure in an execution, but it's time."

MP, Ohio State Grad Student '11 who lives nearby, has spoken to Mrs. Park since.

"She lives in my neighborhood and I was upset to hear that she has received some harassment from some frum people," the mother of 4 told COLlive.com.

"She told me that people didn't know the details of her daughter's murder, yet she had received 'unkind' phone calls. I told her I was planning to write to her and she seemed amenable to a letter."

The woman invited COLlive readers to write to Mrs. Park. Here is a sample letter:

Dear Mrs. Park,

I am writing this letter on behalf of myself and others in the Jewish community to express our apologies for the way you and your family have been treated over the past few weeks.

From what we understand, you have received harassing messages and phone calls and for that we are truly sorry.

That was the reprehensible behavior of a few misguided and confused individuals and we assure you that their conduct does not reflect the general mindset of the Jewish community as a whole.

Judaism, as a religion, places great emphasis on personal responsibility and consequences and we do not believe that any individual should escape the consequences of his actions simply because of his religious affiliations.

I have read quite a bit about your daughter over the last month and it seems that she was a beautiful person with a kind heart.

We are all so sorry for your loss and for the ordeals which your family has gone through over the last 25 years. We hope that now your family can finally find some measure of peace and comfort.

Once again, please accept our sincere apologies for any comments or actions that added to your sorrow.

Signed



Related Articles:
+ Grossman Buried in New York
+ The Day I Watched a Man Die
+ Martin Grossman, OBM
+ Inmate Execution Will Proceed
+ Efforts to Halt Execution
+ Aleph Asked to Halt Execution



Most Read Most Comments


Opinions and Comments
1
Suggestion
Put it online like they did with the petition for Mr. Grossman.

I would definitely sign it.
(2/22/2010 7:19:31 AM)
2
I agree with Mrs. Park
Martin Grossman deserved to die for his crime. He has paid the price. Everyone should now be able to rest in peace but PLEASE do not make a hero out of Martin Grossman.
(2/22/2010 7:31:04 AM)
3
hmmmm
Hi,

I saw your request for an apology letter. I would love to, however, on one very crucial condition; namely you have this approved by a Halachic authority.

I say this because you have to be careful. The unity amongst thousands upon thousands of Jews worldwide garnered on behalf of Martin was an outstanding show of Jewish unity and adherence to our Jewish law which required that. Now of course some people may have gone too far. However if there is ever G-D forbid a similar instance we would like to see the same outcry. You don’t want to be the cause of diminishing that. Be careful about suggesting things in regards to Diney NeFashos without guidance from a Halcahic authority.

I repeat I would love to go along with what you suggest – but please show approval from a Halcahic authority.
(2/22/2010 7:35:07 AM)
4
Thank you
Regardless of where you stand on Mr. Grossman - I think he should have lived - the family of the victim is certainly not at fault - you can direct that at Charlie Crist perhaps.
I applaud this effort and think it is a true kiddush Hashem.
(2/22/2010 7:48:53 AM)
5
You are acting foolish
she said she wants the death of a Jew's very big mistake he made while on drugs after regreting it terribly don't be such a tatale to someone who said he deserves death although she is very pained her daughter was taken away from her, stop worrying soo much about about somone who couldn't wait to have a death of Jew, it this the right halacha?!!!! wow, it would be nice to focus more on ahavat yisroel than feelings of a mother who waited 25 years to have a Jew dead! what do you think your attitude really upsets me!!!
(2/22/2010 8:04:25 AM)
6
to #3
Yashor Koach your suggestion seems a reflection of one who is a yirei shomayim and someone who is in tune with the torah's perspective in general.
(2/22/2010 8:07:53 AM)
7
Poor Mrs. Park!
however anyone fell about Mr. grossman,she's one hundred percent right!
I would sign it!
(2/22/2010 8:11:46 AM)
8
25 years!
(2/22/2010 8:15:14 AM)
9
ask a Rav!
I agree with # 3, there needs to be a rav involved before going ahead with something like this!
(2/22/2010 8:19:04 AM)
10
letter to park
mrs park could have lent her hand to commute his sentence to life. she is a good gentile no doubt and that would have been an act of great courage and forgiveness rather than taking another life that had thoroughly repented. 50,000 people worldwide cant all have been wrong mrs perlmutter.
(2/22/2010 8:30:18 AM)
11
live and let live
you're not suppposed to speak negative about the dead. yes, martin's not a hero, but he did die as a baal teshuvah...
(2/22/2010 8:36:15 AM)
12
Agree
I will sign it in an instant
(2/22/2010 8:57:42 AM)
13
What Rav
Even in Biblical times, you killed someone you got killed - What is up with every one's morals today
(2/22/2010 9:17:07 AM)
14
suggestion
Take out the word "I".

Take out the word "confused".

Take out the entire paragraph starting with "Judaism". Firstly, it is unnecessary. Secondly, it is misleading because it may imply that "Judaism" agrees that Martin should have been put to death.
(2/22/2010 9:39:48 AM)
15
Ask a rav!!!
Ask a Rav!!!
Why are you so sure that she had so many people call her and HARASS her. Maybe she just wanted Grossman killed so she exaggerated a little. Personally I don’t believe that so many people called her and really harassed an old lady.
Every community has some deranged people out there. But considering that there was over 50,000 yidden requesting that Grossman’s life be spared and if a few people called her and really did not scream or threaten her it becomes quite obvious that only deranged people called her and no apologies are necessary if you can verify and make certain that there were actually so many harassing phone calls I would agree with this letter . I need to commend you for putting out the letter in public prior to sending it. But at this point this is a Khal Yisrael issue and should be sent only after approval of a local Ohio Rav
(2/22/2010 9:43:28 AM)
16
Attorney at Law
Execution of a person by a person is wrong both ways
In a civil world there is no way to justify execution
Shame on the mother for her words, by taking someones life in any case, you became the killer. Now two people are dead and the mother is content. that is just plain WRONG
How do you achive happiness trough murder?
(2/22/2010 9:56:41 AM)
17
ya srsly 25 yrs...
the whole situation is a nebach, and noone should ever know of such things! however if the mother traveled on an airplane to watch the execution... "hoping that this will help comfort and closure..." G-d bless the family, maybe they should go for therapy after 25 yrs?!?!
(2/22/2010 10:02:01 AM)
18
barbarians
the death penalty is immoral
(2/22/2010 10:07:48 AM)
19
Apology
Mr Grossman already apologized in public, now Mrs Park must apologies for her words
(2/22/2010 10:10:53 AM)
20
To take any life is wrong
Mrs Park, you should had known better than anyone.
I guess not.
(2/22/2010 10:13:25 AM)
21
approval for the death of another jew?!!?
shocking. you can apologize for harassment and unkind words, but you DO NOT need to show support and approval for his murder, please! lets not get carried away.
(2/22/2010 10:20:31 AM)
22
Halacha first
I am in agreeance with those above...as yidden we do not put our feelings before Halacha. Much evil has been committed in this world through misplaced pity. The Torah has very specific rules and conditions that must be met prior to execution, even by a Beis Din. An "eye for an eye", as we all know is not meant in the literal sense.
Please consult a Rov ASAP, so as not to chas v'shalom err in this weighty matter.
(2/22/2010 10:35:34 AM)
23
oh really?
You think she just wants to have a Jew dead?I think not! The Jew took away her poor innocent daughter and even though it is 25 years,it is eternal pain for the ones who lose a child in such a vicious manner!!Ahavas Yisroel?I don't think so because many Jews thought it was an outrage to fight for a murderer!Those were not heard loudly enough.Yes she deserves an apology.When it isn't your child CV' ,then 25 yrs is a long time-but not for the family!!!!
(2/22/2010 10:41:22 AM)
24
miami beach bum
To #3, #9, and especially #5:

Thank G-d I don't know you people.
(2/22/2010 10:50:53 AM)
25
the Parks asked;
Parks asked for closure, so what are you now continuing, they would like this all to be behind them, without all sorts of ongoing signing,
ect.
(2/22/2010 11:15:35 AM)
26
CH Resident
Miriam,

Well done and big kiddush Hashem and you dont need to ask any Rov.

A CH Resident,

Moshe
(2/22/2010 11:23:09 AM)
27
agree with number 3 number 6 and 9 thank you!!!
Poor Mrs. Park, soo nice to say one someone who waited 25 years for a death of a Jew!!! your sound like Shaul who had pity on amalekim!! Poor Gaza Palestinians who we fight our land back to not make it a burial place for Jews- so still Poor Mrs. Park start having pity on those who really need it!!! And besides there is a big halacha question in this very immature and embarrassing letter just putting yourselves even more low.
(2/22/2010 11:24:16 AM)
28
Lear Chitas this week
I think you should learn Perek 32 in Tayna to see what real Ahavas Yisroel means how every Jew is really one
to make my point think of Martin G as your 4 year old son and lets see what kind of letters you would be writing.
Show Ahavas Yisroel not Ahavas habrios
(2/22/2010 11:25:11 AM)
29
agree with number 3 number 6 and 9 thank you!!!
Poor Mrs. Park, soo nice to say one someone who waited 25 years for a death of a Jew!!! your sound like Shaul who had pity on amalekim!! Poor Gaza Palestinians who we fight our land back to not make it a burial place for Jews- so still Poor Mrs. Park start having pity on those who really need it!!! And besides there is a big halacha question in this very immature and embarrassing letter just putting yourselves even more low.
(2/22/2010 11:39:28 AM)
30
You sure about that?
"we do not believe that any individual should escape the consequences of his actions simply because of his religious affiliations."

Or do we?
(2/22/2010 11:39:40 AM)
31
apology
With all due respect, the apology means nothing if the people who made those phone calls don't sign on it.
For the Jewish community to come out and apologize for trying to save a Jewish life no matter what he did (and again no one said he should be released from prison just not death)
Imho would be a travesty.
Again the ones who harrased should apologize to the family and to the Jewish communiy at large for making a chilul hashem but for as a comunnity to apologize I think is wrong.
(2/22/2010 11:54:54 AM)
32
WHY?
Apology why? her word are very painful, she when down to the same level M Grossman was when he commited the crime,
(2/22/2010 11:57:47 AM)
33
To # 5
She's apologizing for idiotic fools like you.
(2/22/2010 12:07:53 PM)
34
to #13
in those times, people were on a higher level and judged for everything they did.
nowadays, people are on a much lower level in ruchnious
(2/22/2010 12:32:03 PM)
35
Mrs park was and is right
bh
bsd
She was right to complain about us orthodox jews efforts to block what the Torah dictates is the law in murder cases.
We should all ask our forgiveness, and wish her long healthy years of happiness.
(2/22/2010 12:38:28 PM)
36
Reset
Let's all stop right now, and put an end to this ugly topic.
Martin Grossman is dead, G-D will handle it.
(2/22/2010 12:59:42 PM)
37
Praising execution
#32 I agree
(2/22/2010 1:34:29 PM)
38
impressive
as someone who was very involved wit hthis cause.
#1 the letter is very well written and purposely leaves out any controversity... excellent.
#2 i would be a little clearer in stating this, in other words, we are not taking a position here vis a vie marting grossman. just simply saying regardless of Martin Grossman we feel that threats to her family are unacceptable. threats to a victims family are reprehensable and inhumane.
just my two cents.
(2/22/2010 2:17:03 PM)
39
Harrassment? dont be a fool!
"halacha shesav sone leyaakov" she hates you and you r going to gather apology signatures! stop being a fool. she waited 25 years to see him dead? why cant she be satisfied with a life sentence? if she cant forgive one jew, she forsure will not forgive all of those who sign!!!!
(2/22/2010 2:17:09 PM)
40
Well done, Miriam
Thank you for having the courage to step up against popular (ridiculous) opinion and do the right thing. Those who signed the petitions to save a cold blooded murderer's life should at the very least sign this letter too. Show that you have rachmones on all people, since all people were created in Hashem's image.
(2/22/2010 2:38:30 PM)
41
Rivkie
Miriam - well done, U got ur moment of fame! But 4 wat?? Why not rally for sumthing really important instead? Get real gal!
(2/22/2010 2:51:47 PM)
42
From
I believe if the letter is deemed acceptable, it should come from the organizers in FL.
(2/22/2010 3:22:07 PM)
43
To #40 & others
You are all missing the point. When we signed that petition to save Martin Grossman's life, no body asked or expected him to go free. Imagine living 23 hours a day in a tiny cell for the rest of your life. Isn't that punishment enough? It is against our principles as Jews to stand by & do nothing against having a fellow Jew executed.

That doesn't avenge Ms. Park. It just brings a Jew's death. If i had to I would protest again. And i certainly don't accept that her mother was harassed. Anyone who approached her to ask her to reconsider would be considered to be harassing. Doesn't mean they were. It's all a matter of perception.

This petition/letter is disingenuous at best. I agree wholeheartedly with #41. Another apologist of a liberal law student? Just what the world needs.
(2/22/2010 3:23:18 PM)
44
Very Nice
I think the letter is very nice. It assumes a lot of guilt on the behalf of the sender, which is unecessary. I think there should be no mention of apology, (as neither the writer or the organizaer had any wrong doing) rather critique for those who had portrayed unacceptable behavior.

In simpler terms the choice of words on the behalf of the writer (who I don't know) gives legitemacy to the ill feelings towards the Jewish community which have no place.
(2/22/2010 3:30:19 PM)
45
Apology to Ms. Pearlmutter
After this fiasco ends someone will have to write an apology letter to Ms. Pearlmutter for all the abuse she is taking on this site.

I think Ms. Pearlmutter had the right idea to quietly write a heartfelt letter and deliver it to Mrs.Parks. However, putting it up here on the website and basically inviting all the foolish invective all over again is where she went wrong.
(2/22/2010 3:59:54 PM)
46
come on.............
PPPPPPPPPPLEASE.
tell her to get A LIFE!
Martin Grossman killed Margaret Park in 1984.
the state of Florida executed Martin Grossman in 2010.
MOTHER OF PEGGY PARK, MOVE ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(2/22/2010 4:34:53 PM)
47
Heartless people!
More disappointing behavior. People bashing someone who is trying to make a positive gesture. Saying ridiculous remarks making Mrs. Park sounding bloodthirsty. She didn't elect this governor, she didn't make capital punishment possible. All she did was wait for 25 ridiculous long years of appeals.

He should get rewarded for endless appeals by having the punishment changed? Absurd. It makes no sense at all. And if he weren't a Jew, you'd think it made no sense.

Double standards. Insensitivity. Rudeness. Just another day spent in the frum Jewish world.
(2/22/2010 5:02:35 PM)
48
STUNNED!
I DISAGREE ENTIRELY with Mrs Pearlmutter.
1) Why would I apologize for something I haven't done?
2)How do you KNOW that people harassed her?
3)Do you write apology letters to other JEWS in similar or WORSE situations?
4) I believe that Mrs Parks and her family may have been the only people on the planet to prevent Martin's death. How she finds comfort in another's death is beyond me.

Murder is always wrong...whether by a 'criminal' or State Law. Humans do not reserve the right to decide who should live and who should die.
Mrs Pearlmutter, I think you are absolutely wrong. I think this is a total Chillul Hashem, and that you would do wisely to use your knowledge and skill to help your JEWISH brethren!
(2/22/2010 5:05:08 PM)
49
A lover of Jews
Is the author another self-hating Jew? Don't we have enough of those already?
(2/22/2010 5:11:59 PM)
50
to number 13
A sanhedrin which carried out the death sentence within 70 years(other opinion is once in seven years) was considered a terrorist sanhedrin. ALthough it seems that the Torah would judge the same, far from it. There are many circumstances or details involved such as warnings and witnesses which are needed to determine an execution.
(2/22/2010 5:49:42 PM)
51
Frum Yiden???
"We hope that now your family can finally find some measure of peace and comfort"

Are you suggesting that I sign a letter stating that "you can finally find . . peace and comfort" - through the execution of a yid? YIDEN (frume!) are writing this? have you consulted ANY true halachic authority?

isn't incarceration the "peace and comfort" that 98+% of families of murder victims enjoy? are we hoping/wishing that the execution of Martin Grossman give them comfort? Sheimu Shomaim!
(2/22/2010 5:51:29 PM)
52
enough was written!
I think that what was written on the www.savemartingrossman.com website is adequate - no need for any letter or petitions!

"...We, in the name of the whole Jewish Community, express our heartrending despair and condolences to the entire family of Ms. Peggy Park. May G-d grant you all the strength to continue-on and to rebuild the legacy of your wonderful, beloved daughter and sister, may she rest in peace...."

Kol Hamosif Goriea!
(2/22/2010 6:00:04 PM)
53
I do not think this type of letter is called for
Miriam ,
You write that you you wish "to express our apologies for the way you and your family have been treated over the past few weeks. From what we understand, you have received harassing messages and phone calls and for that we are truly sorry. That was the reprehensible behavior of a few misguided and confused individuals..."
May I ask if you have any first hand information as to the nature of this harassment, and the number of people involved?
If yes, please share the details and your source of information.
If it is just hearsay, I do not think is appropriate to to apologize for incidents that may not have occurred, or have been greatly exaggerated, thus adding your voice to those who wish to malign Jews for no reason. If there were only a minuscule amount of people involved in this "harassment" out of the 50,000 or so that contacted the Governor, then again I think it is ill advised to apologize, being that the overwhelming majority of Jews that cared to get involved did so with dignity and respect.
My guess is that Mrs. Park considered any call to her pleading that she add her voice to save the Martin's life - a form of harassment. In truth, there is nothing wrong for a fellow Jew to try every possible means to save a brother's life even calling the victim's mother. My guess is that the calls were very respectful and did not play down her loss or her pain but rather tried to convince her that Martin was truly repentant for the actions he did 25 years ago as a very troubled, scared and drugged up youth, and that the terrible suffering her family endured should not in-and-of-itself be cause to snuff out another life.
Your intentions are noble but I think in this case the best thing to do would be explain to Mrs. Park the the immense efforts put forth by the Jewish community was in no way meant to minimize he pain or her lose. There is no need for any apologies.
(2/22/2010 6:18:46 PM)
54
ARE U KIDDING ME!!!!!!!!!
(2/22/2010 6:31:44 PM)
55
You have no right
You have no right to apologize for the actions of other people who do not want to apologize.
(2/22/2010 6:33:02 PM)
56
kudos to 44
No point in apologizing for something you did not do. We don't even know how many people called her. For all I know it is 1 or 2 people.
(2/22/2010 7:14:24 PM)
57
attention mrs law student
you write:
"Judaism, as a religion, places great emphasis on personal responsibility and consequences and we do not believe that any individual should escape the consequences of his actions simply because of his religious affiliations."

It is NOT because of his religious affiliations that people said that he did not deserve the death penalty. He did not plan on killing this woman when he initially set out that day. The circumstances are not that simple...

And if you are mentioning the Torah, mention the full facts: That a person would not be killed for murder unless there were 2 eidim and hasra'ah...

(2/22/2010 8:12:59 PM)
58
to #45
You're right, you should start an online petition (or whatever) to apologize to the author for so many of us disagreeing with her. Then we'll write one to you. And so the merry-go-round continues.
(2/22/2010 10:19:18 PM)
59
Stop Beating Our Chest With Al Chet
An apology is absurd!

Firstly, it admits that Jews actually were guilty of making harrassing phone calls and messages. That is unproven! Yet, the apology conceeds that this allegation happened.

Secondly, an apology from anyone other than the alleged culprit (or is it culprits) is a collective apology for the "sin" of the collective Jewish People. This opens the concept of collective guilt - ALL Jews are guilty for the actions of one Jew. No, I won't apologize for your actions, and please don't apologize for mine!

Finally, if one were to feel true love and brotherhood for Grossman, what would be wrong with sending a message of contempt to someone who wishes his death?

Moreso, even without the co-religionist / brotherhood approach, many civil libitarians are strongly against the death penalty, and have contempt for anyone advocating the taking of a human life as a form of punishment.

As such, (assuming "someone" called or messaged her) there is no reason to accept that it was a "frum" person, or even a Jewish person who took issue with Mrs. Park's support of the death penalty for Grossman.

Stop beating our chest with Jewish guilt. Leave the public Al Chet to Jimmy Carter. while those of us who need to say it will do so on Yom Kipper. Stop accepting blame for each allegation, and stop beating yourself up for whatever others may have done. Stop accepting each allegation as a bonified claim - too many have been proven false. And stop acting silly!
(2/23/2010 1:46:21 AM)
60
online
Put the petition online Miriam!
(2/23/2010 2:07:19 AM)
61
ch resident
no one is harassing her. We do not need some liberal self hating Jewish girl trying to win favor in the eyes of a goy. Why did this old lady travel against her doctors advise to see the execution? This did not bring back her daughter. The criminal was in jail for life. That should have been enough for her. As a frum Jew we need to save another jewish life even if he is 119 and 364 days old etc. We all got together to sign petitions etc.. Why ruin the unity that we gained. get real. she (both park and ms. pearlmutter want their moment of fame. Why is COL wasting time printing this letter/ Since when do we as frum people get involved with liberals. ms. park should be happy that she was instrumental in killing albeit legally another human being jew or goy.
(2/23/2010 2:37:46 AM)
62
#45
you are so right- that is her only mistake bec we can see how utterly insane some of the responses are- amazing how totally prejudiced some Jews are who call themselves frum.
(2/23/2010 2:39:10 AM)
63
you don't need this
Doesn't matter who is right or wrong. Stop making a new campaign. All is over. Move on.
(2/23/2010 3:14:44 AM)
64
I AM SHOCKED BEYOND WORDS THAT THIS PIECE MADE IT TO A CHABAD SITE!!!
How does one death atone for another? How do humans decide who is to live and who is to die? How does Mrs Parks feel at peace taking the life of another?
The two TRUE expressions of Kiddush Hashem were:
a) Martin Grossman's public teshuvah, and
b)The tremendous outpouring of Ahavas Yisroel as shown by the 50,000 petitioners who were against his death.

May Hashem have mercy on this very misguided author, and may He show her the TRUE way to righteousness!
(2/23/2010 3:35:58 AM)
65
Thank you.
A beautiful letter - thank you.
(2/23/2010 4:00:55 AM)
66
Perek Lamed Bais- Todays Chitas
Todays Tanya LOVE your fellow JEW like yourself it doesn't say love all G-d creatures like yourself it says love your fellow Jew like yourself and if you can see your life being taken by a goy should we love them?
so no letter from me
(2/23/2010 4:34:03 AM)
67
To #53
I absolutely agree with you! Thank you for voicing your opinion so precisely.
(2/23/2010 6:06:21 AM)
68
To #47:
Yup...that's you again, Miriam!
(2/23/2010 6:08:08 AM)
69
ahrei mot kedoshim
who gave you the right to represent the jewish community? Martin Grossman did tshuva brfore he passed away.Thousands of jews and even the vatican asked for clemency for Martin Grossman.Imagine it is your own brother or uncle G-d forbid,with avery low I.Q. on drugs ,terrified the night of the murder.Ahorrible childhood. 25 years in jail is not enough? Of course he did not have a lawyer like O.J Simpson's. Of course there should not be no harassement , those who did ,and only those who did ,should aplogize. Anyway what kind of a person would fly to watch a human being put to death. As far as you are concerned I recommend you should consult with a m ashpia or a Rav A.S.A.P.
(2/23/2010 6:21:49 AM)
70
To #45
I'm not sure if you're Chaim or Miriam...but anyone who has the audacity to put an article such as this on a Chabad website, is asking for it BIG TIME!!! And since Miriam's apparent concern is for justice...let justice prevail!
(2/23/2010 6:21:49 AM)
71
To #68
Actually, I am not Miriam. My name is Jane (the truth) and I live in New York. And I think you're a fool if you think that Miriam is the only person who thinks this way. Plenty of us are supporting her efforts.
(2/23/2010 6:38:45 AM)
72
Ahavas Yisroel!
The "State of Israel" today is governed by self-hating Jews similar to yourself, who also feel this tremendous need to prove that Jews show empathy to gentiles...like the Palastinians. The tragic result is a huge toll on Jewish life...like Gush Katif and the 8-year non-stop rocket attack on S'derot, and so on. Another example is the story of Shaul saving the animals of Amaleik, and the horrific ramifications that followed. This is the effect of misplaced pity. Let us take this love and distibute it amongst our own...Ahavas Yisroel
(2/23/2010 7:05:03 AM)
73
Miriam
I wanted to thank everyone for all their support so far and especially those rabbonim who have signed their names in their official capacities. Although it may not seem like from the comments, there are many sincere people who have contacted me to ask to affix their signature to the letter. I will give it another day or so and then bring it over. Thanks everyone and especially thank you to the collive editors who published this letter!
(2/23/2010 7:13:55 AM)
74
רעיון טוב אבל מסוכן
אני לא חושב
שמחלוקת בין יהודים למען משמימה"לאומית"
של שלום בית של שכנים זה הדבר הנכון
אף אחד לא מאשים את פרקר
אבל ההתמצלות חלילה תביא כאילו עם ישראל באמת אשם ברצח ובטלפונים הללו

היה פשוט יותר לכתוב מכתב אישי
ולא לישות פרפגנדא שגם תזלוג לעיתונות ותביא אנשטישמיות

אין בפטישן עניין לסכסך בין יהודים והעיקר לרצות את האמא
בכל אופן מכתב אישי כן

פאטישן
אי אפשר לגכעת למה זה יהא

אם פרקר תקרא התגובות כאן כבר רק מזה יהיה לה יותר שמאת ישראל
היא לא טיפשה היא הבינה למה היה פטאישן למען מרטין
אבל הטלפונים הטיפשיים הם לא מראים על העידה
ולעשות מזה פטאישן יבא תוצאה הפוכה
במילים אחרות לדוכמא אין לישראל להתנצל בדוח גולעשטין כי אז היא מקבלת אחריות למעשים שנעשו
(2/23/2010 8:15:09 AM)
75
WolfishMusings
"50,000 people worldwide cant all have been wrong."

You want to tell that to one billion Christians? Or one billion Muslims?

An argument from numbers is not necessarily a valid argument.

The Wolf
(2/23/2010 11:22:07 AM)
76
Thank you miriam
Expressed very well.
(2/23/2010 12:46:38 PM)
77
About the 50,000
I hate to tell you this, but they counted the messages that did not ask the governor to cancel the execution within the 50,000. That was the total number of messages he received. Believe me, there were people who didn't ask for a stay of execution. I'm sure there were tens of thousands of Jews who did ask for a stay, but there were some Jews who didn't feel that way.

Either way, it's an excellent letter, Miriam.
(2/23/2010 1:52:38 PM)
78
Miriam, do you like talking to yourself?
All signatures on a petition signal one goal. There were no other options. And the people counting the names were the ones heading the petition. There are thousands upon thousands of misguided Jews...yourself and Mrs Pearlmutter among them. The petition to save Martin Grossman's life was headed by numerous Rabbonim, and their decision was based on Torah. You can argue with the Chief Rabbi of Haifa -a Universally accepted and highly respected Rav - if you want. Clearly you'd lose any Halachic argument, because your mindset is not based in Torah. I'm actually surprised you're not impressed with the Vatican, because that would be much more up your alley! If you have such audacity as to put down huge Halachic authorities, then what you have to say is entirely meaningless. The bottom line is that in the life of a religious Jew, when there is any kind of question it is resolved by our Rabbonim who are more knowledgable and skilled in Halacha then we are. Korach had a problem with a lot of things Moshe had to say...his end wasn't very pleasant. In the letter above there is mention of people taking responsibility for their actions...Hmmm...Now that would play a role over here...
(2/23/2010 4:34:41 PM)
79
Question?
There appear to be numerous requests both here and on Matzav.com for Rabbinical permission for this letter. Why is it that no Rabbi has been quoted as having given his hechsher?
(2/23/2010 4:53:05 PM)
80
Well, it's official
The Jews, formerly the smartest guys around, have become...how shall I put it...a joke. Weeping and rending their clothes over a cold-blooded killer, complaining when somebody wants to express sympathy and rightfully apologize for all the loons.

Miriam P, I'll be sending you my name, and the name of my husband. We're grateful to you for restoring our faith that there are a few Jews who haven't lost their marbles and their morals.
(2/23/2010 5:04:05 PM)
81
to #2
Your judging someone. Its says in the torah. Dont judge your fellow till you stand in their shoes. YOur not in martins shoes, So DONT FREEKIN JUDGE HIM! I would like to judge you for your comments but i leave that to g-d.
only he can judge you.
(2/23/2010 6:32:01 PM)
82
M. Grossman IS our Brother.
And
"YISROEL AF AL PI SHECHOTO YISROEL HU".
Imagine your sidelining in this situation, no matter what happened you would try to save them.
This does not justify Chilul Hashem, and obviously up to a Rov. (especially that it represents Jews towards a goy).
(2/24/2010 9:46:25 AM)
83
MISGUIDED, PERHAPS?
1)NOT ONE OF THE INDIVIDUALS COMMENTING HERE HAS PROOF THAT MRS PARKS RECEIVED HARASSING CALLS. SO YOUR DECLARATION OF CHILLUL HASHEM IS NOT ONLY LASHON HORA, IT IS RECHILLUS. AND YOU ARE ALSO PASSING JUDGMENT ON YOUR FELLOW JEWS. EVEN IF THERE WERE TRUTH TO THIS, AND ONE DID HAVE PROOF, THERE IS NO HALACHIC RULING - OR SECULAR FOR THAT MATTER - THAT REQUIRES ONE INDIVIDUAL TO APOLOGIZE FOR THE ACTIONS OF ANOTHER.
2)WE ARE TAUGHT IN TORAH TO DO ALL WE CAN TO SAVE THE LIFE OF A JEW.THE PETITION WAS RUN AND ENDORSED BY MANY, MANY HIGHLY RESPECTED RABBANIM. DO YOU HAVE THE CHUTZPAH TO DISAGREE WITH THEM? IT IS SAID THAT HOW WE JUDGE OUR FELLOW MAN, SO WILL WE BE JUDGED. WOULD YOU LIKE TO BE JUDGED AS HARSHLY AS YOU JUDGE OTHERS?
3)DESPITE THE SUPPOSED KINDNESSES OF THE FLORIDIAN COURTS, MARTIN GROSSMAN WAS KILLED. SO THEIR "CHESSED" DIDN'T REALLY HELP MUCH. THE KILLING OF ANOTHER HUMAN IS WRONG. IT IS FOR G-D, AND G-D ALONE, TO CHOOSE WHO SHOULD DIE AND WHO SHOULD LIVE. AND WHILE MANY JEWS LIVE IN DENIAL, ANTISEMITISM DOES EXIST. IT IS A GREAT SHAME THAT O J SIMSON'S LAWYER AND MONEY WERE NOT AROUND TO SAVE MARTIN. ALSO, PERHAPS THE STATE OF FLORIDA SHOULD BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE FOR THE FACT THAT A MENTALLY ILL MAN WAS LEFT TO WANDER THE STREETS - PARTICULARLY AS HE HAD BEEN IN JAIL...SURELY THERE MUST HAVE BEEN A RECORD OF HIS MENTAL/EMOTIONAL CONDITION THERE?
4)I ALSO WONDER IF ALL YOU KIND SOULS EVER USE YOUR TIME, ENERGY AND G-D-GIVEN TALENTS TO HELP JEWS IN DIFFICULT SITUATIONS. OR DO YOU GET INVOLVED ONLY TO PROVE TO GENTILES THAT RELIGIOUS JEWS ARE REALLY OKAY? MANY OF US BELIEVE WE ARE OKAY TO BEGIN WITH, AND THEREFOR HAVE NO NEED FOR SUCH PROVINGS.
5)TO REITERATE WHAT HAS BEEN WRITTEN A NUMBER OF TIMES BEFORE, HOW IS IT THAT THERE IS NO MENTION OF RABBINICAL AUTHORITY ENDORSING THIS "LETTER OF APOLOGY"?
(2/24/2010 11:59:47 AM)
84
Nope
He's not my brother. I don't take responsibility for a 200 lb. man who beat a small woman and then shot her in the head.

I've heard people bash Reform and Conservative rabbis and Jews as if they're not even Jews, but this killer is my brother? Because he found G-d in prison?

Sorry. He's no more my brother than any of the men on Death Row. I cried when he was executed but I would do the same for anybody being executed.
(2/24/2010 12:01:24 PM)
85
M. Grossman IS our Brother.
And
"YISROEL AF AL PI SHECHOTO YISROEL HU".
Imagine your sibling in this situation, no matter what happened you would try to save them.
This does not justify Chilul Hashem, and is Obviously up to a Rov. (especially that it represents Jews towards a goy).
(2/24/2010 4:39:29 PM)
86
Huh?!
If you're a Jew then he's your brother whatever he did. Why did you cry when he was executed? You sound a tad confused...
(2/24/2010 4:54:15 PM)
87
was involved
Miriam

With all due respect, the Parks family was not harrased at all. Tis is a pure propaganda issue. The Parks did take issue that the Jewish organizations did not want to see Martin be put to death.
1) Mrs Parks was called and spoken to with a lot of repect that a fund set up by the jewish community would be a better way to remmeber her daughter and would brin better closure than to see Grossman executed. Mrs PArks agreed and liked the idea. It was her son Who is a member of a mission that visits prisoners who said no "he wanted to see him die" Additionally do you think it was that easy to contact the Parks family a day before the execution? why dont you ask her to tell the truth and not make up stories. Additionally it was her priest and leader of the episcopalean church that spoke to her son. If you are a law student et the fact straight before opening your big mouth.

Lastly: Mrs Parks made a statement after he was executed that "Grossman had an easy death". I take issue with that. He did not die in 17 minutes he died in 13,140,017 minutes. For 25 years grossman knew he was going to die. That is a horrible way to die. To have to wait your entire adult life to die knowing that the court can turn you down and the gov will sign a death warrant any day and then its over is a long painefull death. Why dont you try imagining what that is like.

no one ows the Park family an apology. As theJewish community we did what we were supposed to do. Fight to keep someone alive who people who should have had life in prison and not the death penalty. We fougt for a clemency hearing which under the law he had the right to have one, "equal protection of the law" if you dont know what that means ask your proffessor. Or maybe just have a sit down with Allan Dershowitz intead or running around and making noise about something you were not involved in nor understand the true facts. We asked for what was legal and we had a right to. If the park family does not like that thats their right. But in no way shape or form do we have to apologize for that. martin is the one who had to apologize and he did!!!!
(2/25/2010 1:39:08 AM)
88
Response to #86
Unlike many frum Jews, I oppose the Death Penalty. I am sad when anybody is executed. But I was no sadder about Martin Grossman than I was about anybody else dying in that way. He is a murderer. I would have turned his sentence into life without parole if I had the power, but I would have done that for every man and woman on Death Row.
(2/25/2010 2:46:13 AM)
89
Miriam
Follow Up:
I went to visit with Mrs. Park this afternoon. She was very grateful and after she read the letter, she started crying and asking me how she can ever thank these Jewish people who signed the letter because there were no addresses or numbers. She asked me to thank them for her if I ever see them.

(2/25/2010 8:10:29 AM)
90
Thank you!
You've done a wonderful thing, and my family and I are grateful.
(2/25/2010 10:58:23 AM)
What's Your Opinion? Post a Comment
Title:

Your Comment:


Comments must be approved before being published. Thank You!

Make COLive® your homepage | Contact Us
© 2017 COLLIVE.com
1511375902