An open letter from a very hurt Crown Heights mother:
I am just a mother, raising my children in the Rebbe’s shechuna – Crown Heights. I try to develop a sense of Hiskashrus in them as much as I possibly could these days…
Our family knows how important the Tishrei guests were to the Rebbe so we all go above and beyond to be welcoming to them. My kids give up their beds and sleep on couches for a month and I spent long hours in the kitchen to cook for my family and guests.
Then comes Simchas Torah.
This is the one time a year when mothers are invited to bring their children downstairs, to the main shul of the Rebbe. It is a special moment for many of us and an incredible zechus. Some look forward to this occasion all year long, or at least, all month long.
Specific arrangements are made and times are set by the 770 Gabboim, the Crown Heights schools and Tzivos Hashem for the children to kiss the Rebbe’s Sefer Torah and Moshiach’s Sefer Torah.
The thought-process that went into this event is incredible. From the marketing of the event, with the brilliant video and flyer all the way through every last detail. I have been watching this event grow and become more organized from year to year.
I remember the first year when the Rebbe’s Sefer Torah was inside, and people brought strollers inside. It was total craziness. Moving the Sefer Torah to the plaza was brilliant. The line this year wrapped around Union Street for 3 hours straight. Thousands of women and children waiting their turn in line to kiss the Torah.
The High school ‘Madrichos’ were incredible. The girls from 1st through 6th grade were singled out and given Hakofos necklaces with their grade on it as a special entrance pass by the driveway near the Rebbe’s room where they were seated with their grade and looked after by their madrichos.
On the way up the ramp, there were girls helping you take out your children from the strollers and helping your children kiss the Torah. At the bottom of the ramp, there were girls helping park your strollers.
If you are a mother with a child of 0 to 2, you were directed to a special entrance. You got to enter through the main entrance of 770. If you have children 3 to 5, you got directed to the sukkah to enter from the back of 770.
There were barricades set up with girls in charge of making sure that only the appropriate people get let inside. It was their job to instruct all the older girls that they can join from the women’s section and at 9:15 pm they can come downstairs into 770 to kiss the Torah.
As you walked inside you were greeted with a beautiful Hakofos Companion and a bag full of Nosh. A danish, Bisli snack, wafer and lollipop. You could not have done a better job.
Sadly, that’s where it ended.
We walked in and found 770 packed with women and girls. It was a beautiful sight until we noticed that none of the women and girls were Crown Heightsers. They were guests: girls from Israel, France and elsewhere.
We had no place to sit or stand, and we couldn’t even get in to do Hakafos or anything.
And so, I had to write this. I don’t mind giving you my bed and couch at my house, but why take away this single opportunity from your hosts?
You were able to attend every davening this entire month, I couldn’t because I have children and were busy cooking. Besides, we couldn’t even get in because you have filled every inch of the Shul.
So I ask you, why did you steal my place?
Why did I have to end up going home with no Hakafos?
I was so upset, so hurt, I felt like I was robbed, my kids were robbed of this special zechus.
I am glad the guests come for Tishrei to connect and be inspired but what about my Tishrei and my children’s Tishrei?
To the readers I ask: Do you feel the same way? Are you feeling as hurt and frustrated as me? Do you feel robbed? Or is it just me?
i just want to comment 770 is not ‘shayach’ to residents of crown heights more than any french, israeli or any other lubavitcher….. the Rebbe is ‘shayach’ to veryone the same with no exclusion. Simchas Torah is a packed time so if anyone, crownheights’er or not wants to be in wherever it may be, they should come early and be stuffed inside. residents of the rebbe’s shechuna are zoche to be next to 770 the whole year round that doesnt mean that now comes tishrei its packed, 770 is shayach to you!
So this is what Chabad has come to!
All that talk and propaganda about Ahavas Yisroel down the drain.
A generation of vildeh chayos arrive annually from Tzefas and create a nightmare to the locals
But where does this unheard of minhag of women and girls kissing a sefer Torah come from???
I have only heard this practised in Conservative and Reform temples.
Is that where Lubavitch is going?
Hasjem Yerachem!!
Well said! Why stay in Ch? Go to shluchim! I live on shlichus and I could tell you that it would be much more frailech! Yu already figured this out they have “TORAH TOURS” come and help out and allot of times these kids are from big cummmunity cummunities and can’t wait to get away from them. I came to Ch one night of chol hamoed and honestly as an out of Towner it was very touching to see so many people who all came just to be closer to the rebbe I was only there for one night but… Read more »
I am an out of towner who did not come in for Tishrei. I read the article and comments. Being more objective as I don’t live in CH. do not host there , and I had no interaction with guests. I do not feel that the writer was trying to bash anyone. I was actually impressed with all the praise she started off her article with. She was disappointed and was posting so there could be improvements. It did turn into bashing from some of the comments posted, but some were reasonable. What is a over 50 year old supposed… Read more »
Argument that we have it all year and the guest come once a year for a chance is invalid. Tishrie is a special month. And is equally want to partake in the 770 davening during this time.
It’s simple mentchlichkiet that we want.
But simply, It’s a different mentality that clashes that it seems everyone gets frustrated from
A mentality of pushing, screaming, not caring about social rules or politeness, “no” that being an answer, and sneaking into places that aren’t for them if that’s what they want.. Like this hakafos
i hope this isnt true, it just dosent sound right. your stating no one wants to host you, even reluctant family members???? come on, even when we are totally packed with sleeping guests, we always welcome guests to eat. and you should still be happy when you get orchim even if they are there for only touring. its a big zechus to host guests, FOR ANY REASON
A couple of folks ’round here suggested to come and help small town shluchim for yomim toivim. I really wanted to do that for a number of years now, and asked one of the regional head shluchim to set me up with someone who could use some more people at their place. Needless to say, I was going to cover all the expenses for my family. The shliach asked me, can you be a chazzan? No. Can you lein? No. So why would anyone need you, then? So this idea didn’t go far…
We are Shluchim. Like most shluchim, our house is open to guest at all times. However , to find a place for us to stay in crown heights is almost impossible, even at relatives. Even if relatives reluctantly allow us to stay with them, we don’t get any food served to us, and take care of that ourselves. If any crown heightser wants to stay at our house, they stay for free and all meals are served and the fridge is always open for them. And, the reason they usually come , is for touring, not for any spiritual reason,… Read more »
I attended the children’s hakofos in 770 The vast majority of people there were ch women with their children – the amount of Israeli girls there were a VERY SMALL minority I’ve hosted many dozens of guests throughout Tishrei Stood in the kitchen for hours on end / was in 770 on all the yom tov days during Tishrei and was very much part of the complete Tishrei experience in Bais Chayenu Yes , it was often packed, stuffy ….. But mostly everyone was as fair and courteous ( as much as one could be in a crowded situation )… Read more »
i cant believe people are suggesting not having guests. its a staple of yiddishkeit. like the author of article wrote, we also had the zechus of hosting guests, sleeping and eating and it was awesome. we have made many good friends from all the years. i pray to the one above, that i should always have the zechus to host guests. ( and yes i got pushed in shul davening my wife was cooking non stop) zg
Woe unto us if we can’t find it within ourselves to have Achdus, Ahavas Yisroel and compassion when needed, for our Yomim Tovim!
to number 34, yes orchim have the same rights to the 770, but does that mean they can push and shove, its mamesh dangerous for a women above the age of 50 to go to hakafos because of their pushing!. that does not mean that 1, we should not host, as it is a mitzvah to, but i think we are entitled to some mentchlichkeit!
“these people”…. a label appropriate for Tishrei after all YOUR Avodah? “thrill-seeking and parasitism” ???? On Isru Chag there were dozens, maybe hundreds, of girls in770 saying Tehillim, learning Sichos…not shopping in Manhattan, nor seeking “thrills”. You do not have to host or feed guests, but…”parasites? Guests that we have had, over many years, have helped clean, cut up salads, and given gifts with beautiful notes. Please, let’s stop the “them and us” mentality. The guests are not all perfect but neither am I. Let’s just take a step back and cut the negativity. LeShana Tova uMesuka. Mashiach NOW !
maybe have the “mothers only” signs printed in Hebrew and French
I don’t get this – What logic is it for us to say “You have it a whole month, let me have it in peace for one day”
They can just as well respond to us “You have it a whole YEAR, let me have it in peace for one month”
Sounds fair to me. I mean, for me it’s a walk around the block, any day of the year. I did not pay $1,000 to visit 770 for 2 weeks.
I’d grant them their time.
Sorry, I don’t get the logic here.
this whole argument/ article reminds me of the wonderful jewish movie “USHPIZIN” maybe, this is our test and bracha, to host out of towners for this very special time of the year and get nothing in return, aparently. WITHOUT COMPLAINTS OR ANGER. Our sages say that hosting guests is greeting the shechina, let’s make all our learning practical. If you feel like you can’t host, so don’t host anyone. If you do host, do it wholeheartedly, to mesirus nefesh, and that test will probably be greater, probably H’ wil teach us to be REAL FULL BLOODED CHASSIDIM, going BEYOND the… Read more »
We should not be hosting these people.
They should do mivtzaim in Israel and come here for gimel tamuz if they want.
A month of thrill-seeking and parasitism is not appropriate for choidesh tishrei.
Excuse me? While CH has the entire year to pray in 770, with their “reserved chairs”, foreigners wait all year long to come and enjoy the month of tishrei, expecting to be surrounded with an ahavas yisroel vibe, and that CH people would be happy to fulfill a mitzvah by hosting them,but sadly, they get this post. 770 is for every jew!!! What if once in your life you had to share, or stand to daven,? It is sad that people talk so much about achnosas orchim and there still are a bunch of comments telling that “the only solution”… Read more »
I assume that most of us are on this website, like myself, to stay connected with and updated on the events and experiences of our fellow Lubavitchers and Jews. Based on this, most of us are capable of separating the specific phraseology of the article from the point I believe the author is trying to make… if you are concerned about strife and sinas chinam, let’s all try to dan lekaf zechus please! I was fortunate enough to have had a taste of many of the experiences mentioned above, so I would like to add my two cents… I was… Read more »
The Rebbe danced with RaShag- his brother in law-
not zalman gurary- who Razag wedding hall is named for
I also came into that scene, but waited on the side for 20 min and was able to find a place to sit and enjoy after the crowd at the entrance cleared a bit.
unfortunately you are right on target.
Many don’t step in to 770 altogether during tishrei any longer. I bet so many agree with you and do the same.
Let’s put politics aside and find a way to make the shul bigger. There is no way we can continue to have larger and larger crowds with the same physical space. May we merit again where ולא אמר בן אדם צער במקום הזה
Did Rabbeinu Nissienu ever have such a condition that coming to The Rebbe was dependent on a person’s middos and yiras shomayim??? The Rebbe turned away Jews who were not “frum” ???? CH”V. What in the world is wrong with you? You do chesed only in return to get something back? You want to do hachnosas orchim half way? Guests are okay, but not in my section. You sound like you come from S’dom, not Lubavitch.
When it first began – this beautiful idea/ program I used to take my older children when they were young it was too overwelming and my kids hated the pushing and by the time we got in they couldn’t see anything – I don’t bother any mire I just go to a smaller steibel shul with the kids and they are match happier
it wasnt the “razag” that is hall named after reb zalman gurary a”h
the rebbe danced with the rashag ( reb shmaryahu gurary) his brother inlaw
until the rashag was not well then the rebbe danced alone
and that was “mi sheloih rueh “… whoever did not see that …
may we be zoicheh to that gain in our days with moshiach
I’m a mom in CH and without the help of my sister who came with me I wouldn’t have managed. So we need to figure out a way the mothers could get help without letting any girl in.
I haven’t read any of the comments but this post does not sit well with me. I understand that you wanted a place and it’s disappointing…however…it’s not about the ‘me’…and ‘my place’ i feel that respectfully, you are missing the point of 770 altogether. Doing a tovah for another yid is what it’s all about, it may be a sacrifice but it’s a sacrifice worthwhile.
First of all, I ask HaKadosh Baruch Hu to forgive me for reading some of these comments and hearing slander r”l on Yidden after Tishrei. On the other hand, if one Yid is hurt, one must listen and try to empathize and help. Instead of attacking people, I think that we should address the actual problems, which are primarily those of space and time. 770 can be expanded. The Rebbe wanted it. And to refrain from expanding it because of a few signs, or because some want to turn the shul into some kind of “museum” or cultural attraction reflecting… Read more »
How about needing tickets/reservations to get in? And only crown heights residences get first call on the tickets. After a certain amount of time, open the remaining tickets to visitors. Obviously a new system of how its set up is needed and stronger security as overcrowding is a problem – and behavior issues due pop up on Simchas Torah due to alcohol being imbibed in greater amounts. I’m sorry many of you feel used by your guests – perhaps you should consider charging a fee for all your hard work? I know hachnasas orchim is a mitzvah – but its… Read more »
I read all the above comments, and I think the point is– this program is for the children. It’s not even for all “crown heights women”; any crown heights women without very young children are also not meant to go downstairs. The only women who are meant to be there are mothers of young children to take care of their young children– thats it. “It’s not about “us vs. them”. If guests come from Israel or France or wherever with young children– those mothers are also welcome to come with their young children too. Girls and women above the age… Read more »
This is complete opposite of what the Rebbe expects from us all. In every single Sicha the Rebbe spoke about Ahavas Yisroel and that is the exact opposite. It is far more important to work on it than to kiss the Rebbes Torah. What lesson are you giving your children? Focus on the positive and the negative will fade.
Spot on. I don’t know where the “minhag” of kissing the Rebbe’s sefer torah came from. I hear random answers like “this Torah was very dear to the Rebbe”, but this does NOT answer the question.
The Rebbe would much rather you push and shove to help another Jew than to kiss his Sefer Torah. We are losing sight of what is important.
Women need to stop adopting minhagim based on hearsay. It’s healthy to INQUIRE about the source of various minhagim that have not existed twenty years ago.
I had a very similar experience. I avoided 770 for Rosh Hashana, Yom Kippur, and all of Sukkos. I gave up my seat knowing 770 would be packed with out of town guests. But for Simchas Torah I could not resist and went to try to see the last fabrengen. Within 5 minutes I was bullied by a very young girl and told I had to move (I’m married and over 40 so this already was awkward). I held my ground and explained that I gave up my seat for the entire month and only wanted to see the last… Read more »
It just may be that our Tishrei visitors may be bringing upon us more Brachas than the other way around, that is than us upon them!
Yes Tishrei is a month for guests. I get that, really. What I don’t get is why these girls think that it’s acceptable to camp out in 770, claim the entire shul for themselves, and treat the residents like disposable objects, during the holiest month of the year. Personally, I used to walk to crown heights from Flatbush for RH. One year it was really hot, so when I arrived in 770, and I found a seat, I sat down for a few minutes. Less than a minute after I sat down, an Israeli came marching up to me and… Read more »
We’re gonna build a wall around 770 and make the Frenchies and Israelis pay for it!
I have just finished reading this article and the over 100 comments. It is 100% clear from the comments that all the people who were actually inside by the Hakofos felt like it was the most amazing event, it was well organized and enjoyed by all. You can see from the above flyer how well thought out it was. How they thought of absolutely everything. The peoples testimony is clear that there were 30 to 40 people max who should not have been there. Of which many of them were asked to leave and they did. Whats sad is YOU… Read more »
thay come from the other side of the world to be with the rebee yes some or discusting but most or just trying to conect so dont host tham but you cant be upset at tham you have the hole yaer thay dont and just like #31 said no one told you to leave
1.Evrywone comes to 770 some pepole saving up to the last peeny to come in. 2 Some of them from other contries than america that the pepole there have a totally diffrent metality which is okay but chould be annoying. 3 Somtimes mistakes happen while there here bc they are just human. 4 It gets packed in 770 bc pepole are coming all for one reason and 770 is not that big for that many pepole which chould make fights. 5 The rebbe gave out kuntres bais rabeine for pepole to understand what 770 is all about to expand 770… Read more »
First night of hakafos it was my husband and little boys dancing around the dining room table in our small town shlichus. Part of me felt like my kids are missing out so much so we described to them what’s going on in 770 now. If you really want to make an impact you can go help a shliach make yomtov freilach for his far out community and family.
tishrie only happen once a year if you like it or not! for israeli and american! beide there are not jut ch”ers and israeli here for yomtov but also people from across america, europe, australia and o on but for some reason 90% of these complaint are to the isreali guest who think they were the only one that worked to get here! which is not true people of all over work hard, besides what the difference how hard you work if this night happens only once, just because i live here doesn’t mean i get to see hakofos another… Read more »
1) Every Tishrei guest must be vetted as having a good behavior record, with yiras shomayim, midos tovos and derech eretz, for the entire year before being accepted as an “Official Guest”. 2) They must come with a madrich(a) for every 8 – 10 kids (depending on age) who is responsible for their behavior. Anyone who does damage looses their official status immediately and cannot come back the next year. 3) They must spend MOST of their time in supervised learning sessions outside of 770, and 1 hour a day helping their hostess peal potatoes or any other help she… Read more »
Period.
Before Gimmel Tammuz I was cursed out, pushed over a bench, had my sheitel ripped off my head… some of you think it was all so friendly before GT? Most of you weren’t even born then. Speaking of which, these girls have no clue who the Rebbe is. They parrot what they were told and are also told it’s their right to be in 770 & to see and to push, shove and abuse anyone who dares get in their way. My question is, what exactly are they trying to see? I had the zchus of seeing the Rebbe dance… Read more »
the best thing about leaving CH was not having to deal with the French & Israeli mobs of inconsiderate and hostile people. It’s not just teens either; I think the so-called adults (into their 60’s!) are even more violent. I agree with everyone who says don’t host them. The horror stories I hear show how entitled these people feel. If you choose to host/feed them, you have only yourselves to blame. Don’t be taken in by the sob stories – if they show up with nowhere to go, let them take their J&R or Century money and rent a hotel… Read more »
Boruch Hashem, it was beautiful to see all kinds of people gather once again in unity for hakofos in 770, the Rebbe’s Shul. There were hakofos for adults, as usual, as well as hakofos for children. I was there for both, and the simcha was palpable. Ashreinu! Lubavitch 5777 is alive and growing! 1) From year to year, the children’s hakofos, a concept which didn’t exist when my older children were little, gets better and better. Kol Hakavod to the organizers and madrichos!!! This year, Rabbi and Mrs. Shimmy Weinbaum, together with Mussi Kaplan, Baili Vail and a team of… Read more »
Though I understand the author of this article must be frustrated about what happened, I dont understand how this turned into a thread of Loshon Hara and a bashing of all the guests that come for Tishrei. The Rebbe himself called these guests “My Guests” and called on the CH community to help care for his guests that come to spend the holy month of Tishrei with the Rebbe. They are not all perfect, and yes there will be some people who come in that are rude and without good manners but that does not mean that ALL the guests… Read more »
some young people need to behave better, and yes,we can ask Tsivos Hashem for suggestions, while thanking them for a great job. But, please, let’s stop the “them and us” mentality. Sara Mina, thank you for sharing your positive experiences with French and Israeli girls…there are many such examples. Clearly you projected a positive energy.
living in Crown Heights for over 40 years,we have had Tishrei guests from Eretz Yisrael and France. Many beautiful friendships have developed BH. Once it was almost Chanukah and two Bachurim came to the door_ with invitations..they were the Chassanim of girls who had stayed with us in Tishrei, Now I don’t even remember their names, but I do treasure the gesture.
I just don’t get it seeing what the guests did to get in, I was standing there and wondering you hurt ppl fiscally and verbly and where is this all gonna get you?! To the Rebbe to go inside of 770! And this is how you want to go into the kodesh hakdushim in a way you KNOW that the Rebbe is completely against!!!!!! How dose this even work in your head????? Lubavichis based and known for having a root called ahvaas Yisrael so where do we go when it comes to see the Rebbe we will push and punch… Read more »
I don’t usually write my name, but this time I will so that you know it’s real! I live a 20 min drive from crown heights. We came to crown heights only for the last days, and I really wanted to get all the spiritual energy from 770. As a mother I know I’m going not just for my spiritual energy but to educate my girls. The stay needs to be enjoyable for them, so we go for chunks. Up to 45 min. I went both nights of hakofos with my daughters ages 6 & 1 1/2. I explained to… Read more »
B”h, I am blessed to live in Crown Heights. I am able to go to and help out with events all year round. I too swallow hard when I walk in to Shul earlier than throughout the year to find not a single place to sit. But I have a tremendous respect for them and wait for Tishrei all year. This year, I was involved in helping with the Children’s Hakafos. I had one desire: that the Madrichos, Crown Heights Women, and yes, also the Rebbe’s Orchim, would ALL have an amazing experience. And if not amazing, then at least… Read more »
Be nice hosts for the guests now, because very soon be”H, with the coming of moshiach it’ll be them hosting you! Us CH residence will be piling in to the beis Hamikdosh, standing on the edges of other people’s seats, sneaking into the children’s hakafos in yerushalayim, just to get a glimpse of something we want so much to be a part of…
We left at once for the Rebbe‘s shul, known simply by its address number – 770 – in order to daven mincha. I was very excited, because I was now finally going to meet the Rebbe. I had been travelling for over a week and thousands of miles and now I was to receive my anticipated reward. I might have been tempted to wish the Rebbe “Sholom Aleichem” and to shake his hand, but Rabbi Shemtov – my sponsor and guide – had already warned me that I should not approach or speak to the Rebbe unless the Rebbe initiated… Read more »
I live in CH, and I paid $800 for 2 seats. Six seats were sold on that bench. But 26(!) men and bochurim from EY packed themselves in and I was unable to sit in either of my seats. The gabboim told me to throw them out. Throw them out? They threw ME out! This is outright gezel. Their whole “davening” was a מצוה הבאה בעברה.4.
No way to describe my pain.
This is not the truth.
This is nothing but a lie.
Tzivos Hashem has done an incredible job making things better from year to year. This year was remarkable.
What was best anout this year was that it wa so organized.
People kept on speaking about it all around me.
from the begining of the line all the way till the end of hakofos
Why was such a great event experienced by thousands made to seem like such a desaster?
I remember the first few tishreis after gimmel tamuz. The mood was so gloomy, the mourning was palpable. Some people were crying. There was plenty of room in 770. Crown heights was like a ghost town. Then came the push to bring orchim again for tishrei… it was like a breath of fresh air! Tishrei felt like tishrei again, 770 was filled with simcha instead of sadness. Yes there needs to be more Seder and politeness, but I have news for you, this was a problem before gimmel Tammuz too! I remember as a young teenager coming to 770 from… Read more »
A few points : 1 all need to be welcomed at 770 2 Rabbi Weinboum (almost) single handedly runs hiskashrus for our future in these dark days of gulus, for that he needs to be commended. 3 all good things can always become greater its called constructive criticism. 4 as one who grew up in crown Heights i garentee, that if one wanted a similar article could been written every single year during the good years there was always, fights struggles and place snatching in 770 (not defending it just stating the facts) BUT we (chasidim) chose to focus on… Read more »
The Rebbe is our father, we are all his children. What hurts a parent most is when their children fight. This was never much of a problem for Americans before Gimmel Taamuz. Think what the Rebbe would say to this hatred… We are all brothers, no matter where one comes from.
Whoever went to 770 had only the best interest in mind, to be mekusher to the Rebbe. Let’s leave the hatred behind.
In past years there were tens and tens of girls on the Farbrengen bima! This year barely minyan……
I did not notice any areas where there were bunches of Israeli hits in the crowd. In past years there were. Kol hakovod to the door bouncers
I stood on the furthest spot, At the end of the Farbrengen bima by kuti Rapp sign and I heard everything and for the first time I was able to say ata horeiso. I had no disturbances!
Your 100% correct…..
#86
You sound like THE problem…….
I spend $2,500-$3000 having Eshel & the Vaad girls over to eat…..
They spend $750-$900 for a ticket, does’t give them the right to push shove & demand a place front & center….
Thats what this was made for. It’s a chance for them to experience a beautiful hakafos while their fathers make other shuls freilach. When their fathers come back it is too late for these small children to really enjoy.
This article has no basis at all. I was there inside with my kids. Unlike other years there were very few isreal or french or american girls.
Security was very very high to get inside. It was packed and I had to wait for half an hour till people started to leave to get a seat, but it was worth waiting for.
Hakofos was amazing. The singing and dancing were so special.
There is almost 90 comments on this article. where you inside. Or are you just speaking loshon hora.
You are disgusting! Realy a whole year! The whole year we host! We share! We give of ourselves, our families and our finances for out of towners! For kinusim, yomim tovim, Simchos, bar mitzvos, chasunahs, l’ chaims, brissin and more!!!! How dare you! Thank you for this article. I am so burnt out I leave for Tishrei! Yes sad but the only solution for my family. There should be a community day only no guests then a time for guests. You guests have no understanding or ahavas yisroel for what we go through living in CH. be grateful and try… Read more »
There were 1,000 women and girls who attended and had an amazing experience. There were 30 to 40 girls max that should not have gotten inside and of those girls at least 20 of them were sent back out. Tzivos Hashem did the most incredible job. The organization was incredible, as this mother herself said. Barricades were all in place with a team of amazing girls in place to keep a sader. So 40 girls smuggled their way inside of which 20 were sent out. Is this a reason to post an article like this because of 20 spots that… Read more »
I understand what you are saying, but regardless the isrealis generally do not use the american col website, I think that it would be more productive to write an article on that website, respectfully making your point.
Who owns 770? Who can claim the right to it? Why are you even trying to go to 770? To be with the rebbe? If so, let’s take a look and what the rebbe lived his whole life doing. Ahavas Israel. Speaking such open and general lashon hora is disgusting. If you don’t want to host don’t, but you do the own 770 , even if u were born in crown heights. Some of these girls saved up for years to make this trip and instead of putting them down think about their self sacrifice. I’m not gonna lie, it’s… Read more »
l’m in my own dalet amos with hashem
Not all the out of towners came for the whole month. People came from across the world to be here for a few days. For example, I came for the second days of Sukkos. I live far away, and you cannot imagine the longings that we chassidim experience from afar. You can never measure how hard it is for someone to be far away. From your words, it is clear you have never tasted the difficulties that come with living away from family. That is why it is easy for you to be upset with us. I think you have… Read more »
The whole thing of kissing the Rebbe’s Sefer Torah is something new and an attempt by the kidnappers of 770 to control not only the Shul but also the people. You can kiss the Rebbe’s Sefer Torah on Parshas Noach or Chanukah or Purim without having to deal with the crazies that go to Uman for Rosh Hashana and CH for Succos. just for the fun and action. It’s sad.
I grew up in crown heights and I have to say that the hachnasos Archim in crown heights is something you can’t find anywhere else. Tishrie and then is college campus and kinus haShluchim & then Chanukah guest and then cteens, kinus hashluchos, guest who come for weddings/ bar mitzvah pegisha, gimmel Tammuz etc…. I remember weeks that my mother changed my linen nearly nightly to accommodate different guests. I slept many weeks in a row on the floor in my sisters room to make room for the guests. Growing up my mother did (and still does) it with a… Read more »
yup,you are so right ,why blame guest? still have hachnosas archim! and also mrs.weinbaum DID tell the mean/wild kids to leave so dont complain!
Why the day after yom tov would someone start a thread geared at causing strife… Borcheinu avinu kulanu keechod!
As long as there is an organized line to kiss the Sefer Torahs then be happy , I’m not sure what else there is too see… Maybe lets work on promoting achdus so we can actually see the Rebbe by hakofos.
It’s really not right to generalize about all Israelis based on a few bad experiences. For the few years I have been living in Crown Heights, I have often found the guests to be very understanding and welcoming. When I asked to be let in to see hakofos, or to sit down to rest on a bench, there were always friendly girls who offered their place for a few minutes even though they had probably gotten there hours before me. Sure, there were some rude people, but I learned to just walk away and ask someone else. A smile and… Read more »
Is this what the rebbe wanted that you should be so selfish
What is this sinus chinam!!!
I remember the year the rebbe had a stroke it was the first and only year there was a rotating system to see the rebbe in the woman’s section. sadly it was the only year i remember when people asked each other would you like a turn.
From the side of the guests i can say that the gabaim and the madrichot do a really great job and let the guests to enteranve 770 ONLY after the hakafos with the kids ends And i think this is how it should be So mayb u had a not such a good expiriance but also woman and girls- guests that wants to cone to the program are sent up to the woman section untill it ends and can come down at 9, 9:30 And mayb if everyone deserves to come to the rebbes shul once a year (not like… Read more »
Do we have problems those shabbosim when crown heights is also packed and our houses are full of visitors?
Or are the problems only in Tishrei?
Hmmm. So what’s the difference then, I wonder?
Will anyone dare say it?
I love all the people commenting about Ahavas Yisroel and bringing Moshiach! Firstly Ahavas Yisrael works both ways!!! A mother who has the ultimate AY by hosting, cooking, serving spending $$ the whole Yom Tov is asking for a little something in return (or not in return necessarily ) but just a little Mentchlichkeit so she can have a little joy of Yom Tov too (other than slaving in the kitchen) and all the people who haven’t even set a table the whole YT are calling Ahavas Yisrael??? I am a CH mom who doesn’t go near 770! Barely even… Read more »
Put it on col.il in Hebrew and on Hassidout. Com in french
If you want to be uplifted on Simchas Torah, find shluchim and go help them make simchas torah in their community.
You will feel the Rebbe and feel amazing yourself. Since gimmel tammuz I have never spent tishrei in CH instead I went to shluchim and then became one myself.
A couple years ago I go with my children to kiss the Rebbes sefer Torah and then we go home to prepare for all our Orchim from all over… I don’t even attempt to go in anymore after one lady once sat right in front of my children and said ‘too bad I came for this’ and left my small children hanging, begging just to watch hakafos
Why u r upset ? You have tons of small & big shul in the CH that all made amazing Tishrej , some Shuls had only kids programs ….. Why u need to go and see all the balagan in 770 , come with your kids in any other” open ” less crowdy …. Ps …. I do like guests , but all of them must be registered like in the shluhim office and get picture ID and a free pass to 770 so at least u know who they are and from where they are …. drugs /drinks will… Read more »
The whole thing of kissing the Rebbe’s Sefer Torah is something new and an attempt by the kidnappers of 770 to control not only the Shul but also the people. You can kiss the Rebbe’s Sefer Torah on Parshas Noach or Chanukah or Purim without having to deal with the crazies that go to Uman for Rosh Hashana and CH for Succos. just for the fun and action. It’s sad.
We need to screen which types of guests are coming here for tishrei, when Israel/France sends their people, they’re not sending their best. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. And some, I assume, are good people, but we need to stop letting everyone come to 770.
1. Why are the guests pushing? What exactly do they expect to see?
2. What is this new minhag of kissing these sifrei torah? Sounds like idol worship to me
Your sense of entitlement is astounding.. Chassidim are moser nefesh for ahavas yisroel andChassidus has never been about “only the good ones should come here.” The pure sina you emanate due to your inconveniences is DISGUSTING. Worry about the poison that goes in and out of your mouth and ears and every pore of your body before you worry too hard about whether or not you deserve a seat to sit, or some personal space to not be jostled. Unbelievable.
Neither group should have to give up. Yes, better guidance and supervision is required.
Nevertheless, to help people move upward and forward with the best attitude, think about the following paradox:
In the Beis Ha-Miqdash, ‘when they stood [upright] they were squished, but when they bowed down, there was plenty of room’ (Pirqe Avos, Chapter 5).
Last time I had the z’chus to be in 770 I was embarrassed by the brutal treatment of some guests. Neither the lady in charge nor the girls she was trying to remove from their perches were speaking and acting in a manner befitting the holy edifice they were in. A change is in order, beginning with the schools abroad, the Vaad Mesader, the madrichos and organizers of the groups. I spoke to leaders of the two Israeli groups, and expressed my disappointment in some behaviors that really stung. I don’t have the answer, but committees must be formed with… Read more »
As the new year approaches, I feel lack of excitement and even dread. Every year, the same thing happens; the guests come tumbling in to 770 with so much excitement, that they forget we are people. Pushing, shoving, yelling… Why? I understand, you are here once a year, this is the only time you can be by the Rebbe. But would it hurt to say excuse me before knocking someone off the not so sturdy ledge on top of fifteen other people because all the other guests came to 770 at 6am to save seats, and that is the only… Read more »
As a former resident of israel currently residing in crown heights, I am shocked and disturbed by the racist and discriminatory comments here aimed at Israeli and French visitors. When you visit Eretz Yisroel you are not belittled, condemned, hated, detested and despised. You are well treated and respected. You have forgotten, or maybe never realized, that these are the Rebbe’s guests. How comfortable would you feel to stand in front of the Rebbe and repeat these comments about his guests to him???? The Tishrei guests bring a warm and festive ambience to the frigid neighborhood. I, for one, am… Read more »
well in years past they used o print a booklet for the guests with instructions like telling them that on roish hahshanh seats are sold and how to behave when you are a guest in a house and other things like crossing signs etc but truth be told a lot of kids boys and girls ages 13 to 19 and older come unsupervised and there should be constant supervision from the yeshivois and schools they study in before they allow them to come and to shimmy weinbaum you do a great job i think its time to to do 2… Read more »
Dear CrownHeightZers, don’t forget that tourists bring a lot of business to the local stores and without the frenchies and israelis, the economic situation of Crown Heights would have been very different so, whether you like the tourists or not, they keep your neighborhood alive
I was in 770 last year and I had not the best feeling when a girl told me here it’s my place, so I decided to leave 770 ! I got upset and I didn’t wanna go to 770 until the end of my trip !! After a short reflection I told myself everything is ashgocha protis and I came back to770 ! We shouldn’t be upset we should ask our self what can I do now to bring moshiach and be in the beis amikdash Ashlishi with the Rebbe?! There we will have enough space and we will not… Read more »
I had last year my Israeli niece take my granddaughter to the Hakkofos. She wanted to enter inside, so, she asked us if she can take a child. And so did her friends. They took some children and took care of them all through the Hakkofos. They did nothing wrong. Don’t generalize.
A
#25 is on the money 👏🏻👏🏻
Translate the article and it might reach those it was intended for!
Agree with #19, 20, 26, & 27. We must expect some inconveniences at the very least. Moshiach cannot come if we do not make true efforts. I too get easily stressed & irritated at times Hashem forgive.
OUR GUESTS ALSO HAVE TO REMEMBEBER THAT SIMCHAT TORAH IS ONCE A YEAR FOR US ALSO AND THAT IS WHAT I TELL THEM WHEN THEY TRY TO SHOVE ME OUT OF MY SPOT. AND I MAKE MY STAND AND bH HAVE BEEN SUCCESSFUL . I REALLY DONT LIKE BEING THAT WAY BUT WHAT CAN I DO?
This must be translated to Hebrew and given to the girls before yom tov.
i feel yr pain , but thishri is the yom tov 4 the guest . they are the rebbas guest , its a good time for crown heights people to get out of town and help a shliac . this is a month when they can use yr help , we all have family on shlicas , next year if moshiac did not come , take time off and visit yr family or friend on shlicas , i went to montreal for the first days of sucath and for rosh hashona i was by a sliac in n. j. and… Read more »
I hosted and served more guests then I can count. I don’t know any of their names but served food all day long. The people were polite in my house however when I came to 770 they seemed like different people. I didn’t go all tishrei because I felt I can’t go in. When simchas Torah came I figured I’ll try to go in for a few minutes. Wherever I went I was sent away and told the spot is taken, I asked if I can see for five minutes but was denied. Where is the mentchlichkeit? Is it all… Read more »
An article bashing Jews? This is so weird.
Right after the holiest days of the year, no less.
Bear in mind all your comments are being read by Jews who are not Chabad all over the world, with dastardly repercussions.
You should make sure that the comments that you post don’t destroy the beautiful reputation of the Rebbe around the world.
Many of us feel the same way, as the comments seem to demonstrate. The guests who come are very set on the purpose of their visit and will do anything to take in every moment that they can. Sadly, this is at the expense of Crown Heights residents and other guests who would rather keep their dignity over their right to see. Conversing with some of the guests, it’s a sad revelation that they simply forget to think of others in the mad crush to get as close as possible and stay there for as long as possible. Bringing up… Read more »
There is a solution to all the single girls coming into the downstairs. Just like at the Ohel Non Lubavitch Security is hired to man the fort on busy days they should hire non Jewish security to stand and see who is coming into 770.
That way the girls who think they belong downstairs will not be allowed in.
A more pleasant way of dealing with all of this, is mandating a farbrengen in Oholei Torah for all single girls at the time of the childrens hakafos.
I was a matricha at the door, and u don’t know how hard it was to try to keep them all out, so plz don’t blame us, we tried our best….. I got physically hurt by someone who tried to get in and I didn’t let, so it’s a hard job but worth it. I really disagree with you saying that we let people get in some people got passed us with curses or sneaked in when I opened the door for kids, but majority people didn’t pass so ask the madriachos before making such a statement
A couple of points 1. There was never such a thing as a line for people kissing the Sefer Torah’s, so say thank you that the idea even exists. 2. If you’re waiting a entire YEAR or an entire month just to miss the Sefer Torah that went not talk to the Gaboim or shimy winbaum about arranging after (or before) Tishrei a time shown all Crowd Heights women come to kiss the Torah (this can even be done during the week) that would save all the crown heights women a huge headache and on Simchas Torah it would be… Read more »
Are there any CH’ers who had their guests offer them their seat during hakofos?
Let’s hear about some of those please
I live in an out of town anash community. Before yom tov i was called several times by someone who asked to to donate tzedaka to a CH organization that iis organizing and taking care of the guests who come in to CH for yom tov. Honestly, I was floored by this request. Our tzedaka resources are limited, and should be prioritized for families that need help with paying for basic food, chinuch, weddings, and other necessities. If someone wants to take a trip to CH for yom tov, so be it and pay for it and enjoy it yourself.… Read more »
for all of you who want to bash and speak loshon Hora right after a full month of Yomim Tovim, be that way.
I think that Tzivos Hashem deserve a Massive thank you for the amazing work they do
To #27 im glad for you that you had a positive side. But i did not. I did not get to see or even hear anything. I just tried to entertain my younger ones while we waited for the program ti finish.
To #28: one section. Was full of mothers and toddlers. The other was full of israeli girls.
I feel your pain, but did anyone specific purposely did this to you? How can we think about the takona if we do not even know who to blame. Each person that came there, very possibly, though that it would be most fare that you would be able to attend, but collectively, none probably thought that it is she who did not let you. Sorry, I just have no answer, I wish I had.
Seriously these people do not get to be even upstairs in 770 the whole year, and everyone has a right to be there.
Especially because tishrei only happens once a year! And everyone – even the ppl from crown heights! They only get to see hakafos on simchas torah once a year the same much as the israelis, and frenchies and what not!
Every year I witness some Israeli Bachurim pushing and shoving in 770 a whole Tishrei with no respect whatsoever.
On Simchas Torah there’s fighting, violence and water bottle being thrown and sprayed at random people.
Which Yeshivos do these creatures go to? And why do they come here?
Only the GOOD and SERIOUS ones should come!
I totally agree with this article!
To #20: we do live here all year but Simchas Torah takes place once. I personally stay out of 770 for most of Tishrei for this reason. There is one time we get to go in and have a spot. Why take that away from us? Why cant they be respectful ? There are hakafos after which they get to join.
Do you own the place? its a city were happens to be a important thing for Chabad people and we have the right to visit it as much as you have the right to live there!
What à ahdoute.
how can à jew talk like That?
You can erase your article. its just à shame.
Évery oné are making efforts. but to blâme israélis or french People tout own CH its not right to talk like that.
anyway talking nicely after the haguim its thé Best you can do.
thé 770 is not only for thé families Who lives in CH.
its for Éveryone its thé rebbe shoul .
May you think only positive on your jewish fellows.
Lest be practical 770 is so small for today’s crowds. How many people are able to sit inside. They had 400 seats under the ladies shul adnother 400 seats in the back center of 700 and another 200 people on the Rebbes farbrengen bima, thats max 1,000 women and girls that can get inside.
The smell of weed on kingston was delicious!
oops. that has nothing to do with the guest.
You write a whole article but fail to explain why you were not there. Did anyone tell u to leave? Even if there was no reserved space for people from CH, you could’ve stayed…?
A little clarity would help. BTW, all this was organized by the amazing Rabbi Shimmy weinbaum from our Tzivos Hashem in CH, who would listen to suggestions or criticism. Call him and move on.
Have a great year
Why blame the guest??!!
I saw Mrs Weinbaum going over to those girls and asking them to leave
The article was written by a woman who is upset she wasn’t able to watch hakafos yet most comments are about the chaos in the shul caused by the same people the author wanted to see in action!
Or maybe she doesn’t like the female guest but has no problem with the drunk kids who beat up the son of the other commentor for not saying yechi etc.
Who are we bashing exactly?
Maybe we should do 2 bashing articles.
I have one question to all the people who posted comments?
Where you there?
I looked around me there may have been a few girls but almost all the people were mothers with young children.
I was a mother who did get inside and I have never experienced such a special Simchas Torah.
My kids were so excited to kiss the Rebbes Sefer Torah. It was so special to see my boys dancing, and my girls waving their flags.
Really the current tragedy is that Moshiach has not arrived, as of yet. When we are put in a situation where we are “forced’ to be מוותר, its a golden opportunity put in our laps, to hasten the Geulah. We can go on and on, claiming “our rights” or we can bring Moshiach faster and help end our brethrens’ suffering that much sooner! I was also in 770 for hakafos with my children and could barely see or hear anything. But at least we should be careful how we speak and write about our fellow Yidden. Ahavas Yisroel trumps all… Read more »
Amazing article and respectful. Can you please translate it in Hebrew so the people who need to read this can understand it
AGREE WITH #19 & 20
we crown hightsers are in crown heights the whole year we have many times during the year to be in 770 while these girls are only here for one month!
lets stop thinking only about ourselves and start caring about others also
they worked a lot harder then us to be by the rebbe for Tishrie !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Crown heights hosts all year long for different events, only tishrei seems to be the problem bc the guests don’t act like mentschen (I’m obviously generalizing, bc some do! But the ones that don’t ruin it for everyone. Crown heights is not a tourist attraction ,it’s a community where families live all year round. We have a right to ask people to respect our community. We pay high prices to live here and enjoy the conveniences. If you want to have a “right ” to crown heights then come live here and maybe you’ll understand 😀
I went downstairs my daughter was traumatized, we left after 5 minutes. I was disappointed and disgusted by the Israeli and French girls, However I also saw a bunch of older crown girls too. They put a bunch of young girls in charge at the gates and people were able to sneak out easily
you wrote “BTW those who comment don’t host them probably never hosted them and for that matter anyone else. ” How can you be so sure? just so happens, I personally have hosted dozens of guests over the years. sleeping, eating, the works. And I not only agree with the comments, I have stopped having guests. I felt used up, worn out and taken advantage of. But the final straw was last year, when my son and his friends in Oholei Torah were being bullied by a group of israeli kids in their so called “moshiach camp”. These unruly, rude… Read more »
they or we (i am not a israeli or a frenchi) but we come in especially for this and we are entitled to it as much as you are!!! You have it the whole year how much more so you should atleast have the dignity not to write this article and be so selfish because us americans who come from america and are not asking ppl for their beds etc. come in especialy for this whole expereince and you want to be so selfish as to take it away? because this is your place of birth or were your house… Read more »
I am so sorry that you and your children were not able to partake of the Children’s Hakafos. There definitely has to be a stricter way of enforcing who can and cannot come downstairs in 770 – and one that actually gets implemented. Crown heights women and children ( especially when hosting guests) definitely deserve their allotted time for tishrei in 770 to be respected. However, let’s not all blast the guests in our comments! They definitely bring with them a special Chayus, which otherwise would be missing in Crown Heights over Tishrei. Saying to not give money for people… Read more »
It’s definitely chaos. I remember it being chaos back when. I was a girl. Israelis will always be “Israelis” when they come here. I don’t host, as I don’t understand their mesiras nefesh of coming here. Before gimmel tammuz the Rebbe made it a thing of hosting the orchim so they can spend Tishrei with the Rebbe. It’s post gimmel Tammuz and 770 is an embarrassment because of these Israelis who just sing yechi and act like Terrosists. It’s time for these people to shape up, if they want to come here. Crown heights shouldn’t have to put up with… Read more »
Long time ago I stop to come to 770 I live in Miami I came with my kids we drove and I didn’t enjoy at all I came with 6kids we came and no one let us see what going on we just sit outside my kids don’t want to come to crown heights for yom tov
i feel the same way. robbed. invaded. used. a few years ago, i decided to privilege my 5 children (all relatively young) with the experience of watching hakofos in the men’s section of 770. after bundling everyone up (it was a cold sukkos), we made our trek to 770 (we live on the other side of the shechuna). when we got there, we had to wait in a very long line in the cold. once inside, we were directed to an area very far away from the bimah. when we came to our “seat” i was annoyed to find that… Read more »
Before gimmel Tammuz there was a fancy booklet sent out asking every anash family to donate a sum to expand 770.
I remember the plan having stadium style seating for the ladies section….
Also, while I understand the mother’s frustration ( my experience also tested me in many ways)
I would love to see a different approach, that addresses the issue in a more uniting way.
Let’s face it, when the organization collects money, all the Crown heights people give.
It’s OUR problem.
Stop giving, and while Drizin gives, we all have a problem.
Make 770 bigger. In the last twenty years many chasidishe Hoyfen had their shuls expanded it is time we have the Rebbes Shul expanded.
BTW those who comment don’t host them probably never hosted them and for that matter anyone else. The Oibershter blibt nisht kain Ball Chov those who did merit to host the orchim and sacrificed much for the wonderfull orchim will reap the results poshut bgashmiyus plus their children will have a geshmak in doing a mitzvah. Only fools and selfish … write foolish comments like that.
N.S.
Even me stayed upstairs eventhough I could’ve helped out wth my grandchildren downstairs. I didn’t want to take away the opportunity from someone else. I personally spoke to several Israeli girls to STOP asking every random mother is they can”help” them with their kids. It was DISGUSTING!!! THEY SHRUGGED ME OFF!
I had a simiilar experience. Simchas TOrah day I took my two daughters, 9 and 10, to 770. It was later in the day around 4:00 We just wanted to pop in so they can see the goings-on in 770. We found a spot up front and a small area on the bench for them to stand on to see better. An Israeli girl in Hebrew started yelling at me. I explained we were there for just a few minutes, and I don’t speak Hebrew. She changed into English and said she was saving the seat for her friend. I… Read more »
Tbak God I left for Simchas Torah !!!!
And we, the locals of crown heights, are to blame for this craziness!
Next time you get a call “can you host guests?” say NO!
When you get a call to donate to some charidy campaign or another for this, say NO!
If we put up with it and pay for it, we have Noone to blame but ourselves.
Some Israeli tried throwing my son from the bleachers because he tried stopping a fight that was coming close to him, someone has to do something about it
The writer is right on target! A few years ago I went to the children’s hakafos and it was really beautiful. The teens, etc. from Israel and France watched from the weibershul, not downstairs. What changed? Whoever is in charge, please change it back to the way it should be!! Just FYI, Crown Heights women (married, or “of a certain age”) do have their own designated place for Shacharis during Tishrei on Shabbos, Sukkos, Shmini Atzeres and Simchas Torah: on the Eastern Parkway side in the 2nd shul. If you can get a babysitter one morning, this is wonderful! Special… Read more »
As a madricha I know we tried very hard to only let the mothers and children in some we had to hold back physically. We really did our best to ensure the children had the hakafos experience. And yet there even crownheightzers who were bringining in older girls from crown heights anf from isreal claiming they needed their help and pushed passed the barricades beyond our control. Need not put all blame on the girls while your fellow neighbors..
Even if we don’t host them, they still come so that is not a solution!
OP – well said!!! I’m sorry that you had to go through this 🙁
I am so tired of this attitude that the guests seem to have that they come here and they own the place. My son came home devasstated from 770, he was thrown from is ‘makom kavuah’ by some israeli, and then when he dared to not sing yechi, some drunk other israeli practically beat him up. This is not acceptable and should be stopped. I say if they want to bring them here, thats their issue, but at the very least there should be some kind of seder and someone in charge of them. And simchas torah was a disaster.… Read more »
DONT HOST THEM!
(I stopped a few years ago)
Just dont host them, most only make problems and corruption in 770!
Was also last year…and so we didn’t even attempt this year..o well…..what else is new??