Jan 16, 2014
Wanted: New Shidduch System

Shaindel and Chani, two single Chabad girls, say the community needs to reassess the strategy and structure of the current shidduch system.

The following was sent to COLlive by two single young Chabad women, Shaindel and Chani, in response to the article "A Friday of a Shadchanis" about the challenges of being a matchmaker:

It's just not working.

There are hundreds of single Lubavitch bochurim and girls out there in every community, who are relying on the "system" to help them find their bashert.

Shadchanim are working tirelessly, parents are losing sleep and are frustrated that the Shadchanim don't have enough time for them, and singles are losing hope (and their minds).

The way it's been working, since even before our grandparents times, has always been that third-party individuals, be it a matchmaker, friend or family member set up two potential soul-mates. They go out; either they don't click or they do and there's a Mazal Tov.

We've moved on.

Like in any growing community, changes have to be proportionate to the amount of growth occurring. As a community or business gets larger in size, it needs to reassess its strategy and structure. Sometimes, real changes are called for. Even if they may be daunting and overwhelming to face, they represent growth and success.

We have a beautiful Lubavitch community, which has grown and expanded tremendously. It's time to propose (no pun intended) a revolutionary response.

The new shidduch initiative would take out the feeling of being unappreciated and unpaid on the shadchan's end and the feeling of being lost on the side of the singles and their parents.

There is a need for a Shidduch agency to open and run like any business would; with secretaries, staff, organized computer system, professional profile matching, and of course, shadchanim.

These shadchanim would be paid for their time and efforts. They can work full or part-time and if the needs call for it, more can be hired and trained. Singles would then have an organized place to turn to, be interviewed and then set up with their potential bashert.

Phone calls and emails will be returned in time, names and notes will be remembered (avoiding "They said no but I can't find the reason in my notepad"), shadchanim won't make you feel like they are doing you a favor and we won't have to beg.

The slight issue here is that as much as we think this is a grand idea, we ourselves are looking to turn to such an institution to help us find our own husbands. As they say, necessity is the mother of invention.

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Opinions and Comments
1
Nice idea, but...
it's a personal thing. People won't feel so comfortable having a whole agency and staff knowing their most private issues.
(1/16/2014 11:04:30 PM)
2
Yes!
The time has come to make this idea happen. Sanz-Klausenberg is doing it, with fantastic success. They've seen their lists of older boys and girls shrink very significantly. Shadchanim also get paid a nice amount per shidduch, at least partially from a central fund, and the harder the shidduch, the more they get. The only questions are, 1) who will take charge of this and 2) who will fund it? The Klausenberger Rebbe called solving the shidduch crisis a case of Pidyon Shvuyim, so in their community, funding it is top priority. Will we make it top priority as well? I hope so.
(1/16/2014 11:08:34 PM)
3
Well written!
Well thought out and great you gave a solution. It may be a great idea for you yourselves to begin the project and be the creators. Just because your not married, doesn't mean you can't begin a business. You seem to have great ideas and intuition. Good luck!
C H. fl.
(1/16/2014 11:08:52 PM)
4
concerned mother
Recently I was conversing with another concerned mother. We both discovered we had been dupped by the same shaddchun.
She told us both the exact same thing" I do not have any bochurim for your daughter" after she collected our $180.00. What has happened to this noble profession?
(1/16/2014 11:09:24 PM)
5
Looking for shidduchim for my kids:
Great idea.
(1/16/2014 11:10:21 PM)
6
Great Idea!
This sounds like a very logical idea to solve much of the shidduch crisis we find ourselves in today!
(1/16/2014 11:10:34 PM)
7
Dumb.
Won't work. The same reason the system now "doesn't work" this "new" system you've thought of won't work either
(1/16/2014 11:14:51 PM)
8
Proposal
To have like a Facebook shidduch group where there are all boys and girls in shidduch age where parents can send their kids profiles to other parents and once a date is set up a shadchan appears in scene to monitor
(1/16/2014 11:17:06 PM)
9
A shadchan replies
I am a shadchan, and believe it or not, there already exists a Shidduch agency similar to the one you describe! It is a fantastic on-line approach with a great success rate. I don't know if I'm permitted to mention the name here, but I strongly suggest that all singles join if they are truly marriage-minded. It is open to all, and the shadchanim can choose which religious denominations they want in their network. I myself only work with Lubavitchers and other Chassidim (I am Lubavitch) but I have access to the entire site and it's sister sites which, in total, have 30,000 members world-wide. We matchmakers are usually a pretty dedicated group and really want to help. Let's see a lot more marriages!
(1/16/2014 11:18:01 PM)
10
Old days
It should work like the old days yes third party involved however it was the norm. For guys to meet and have mixed events. Period! And don't tell me it works the other way!
(1/16/2014 11:19:18 PM)
11
DMV
when people dont get paid for results they tend to work slower. see every government agency we all dead going to the dmv
(1/16/2014 11:24:30 PM)
12
My guy
My (chasideshe) husband walked over to me in a store on Kingston ave! And said " hey u have nice eyes and I felt he meant it then asked me if I wanna go on shelicos and I said perhaps the right one and he totally understood it. Anyway we are happy married and both working in Avodas hakodesh and no we are not modern or Chabad light!!! Both from gezhe! I dress tznios and he dose t wear a ring with a baby face and kapota!
Good luck to u guys working with old outta touch lady or yente guys to put ur life in order!
(1/16/2014 11:25:43 PM)
13
yes
there are enuf people out there who don't have a shlichus job and are unemployed. why doesn't anyone start this business and direct this by fundraising and hiring and runing such an institution. it is a MUST, very soon the families in need will be providing the necessary funds to keep it running. every one should have to register , as imp. as the dor yeshorim tests, and pay a reg. fee and so on...
(1/16/2014 11:26:18 PM)
14
Disagree.
This takes the heart and soul out of matchmaking.
There are challenges and glitches in our shidduch system but no solutions. The problems have become the rules, and I'm not here to list them.
My message to the singles: look great, enjoy who you are, and daven every day, more than once a day, whether that's formal davening or tehillim, and ask HaShem to being you to marriage ASAP.
Marriage is miracles.
(1/16/2014 11:30:35 PM)
15
friends best shadchanim
there needs to be a new system where the newly married try making shiduchim for their unmarried friends
(1/16/2014 11:31:18 PM)
16
Disappointed
I was expecting some ideas that would make finding the right match LESS bureaucratic and byzantine, and this "solution" does the exact opposite. We all know that going through a shadchan means they need to figure out which box you belong in, so they can find you someone who fits into the exact same box, and woe is you if you don't fit into any of their boxes, or you're interested in someone who fits into a different box. They have their bronze, copper, silver, gold, platinum and diamond +++ shidduchim, and don't even think about going for someone outside your "level."

What I suggest is going back to the basics. If you're interested in someone, find anyone who knows them -- a friend, a relative, a neighbor, an old teacher -- who is willing to suggest the shidduch. It doesn't have to be an official shadchan. And once the shidduch is suggested, the shadchan's job is over!!! There's no reason they have to keep shuttling messages back and forth between two adults. Let's teach our young men and women how to communicate with each other with honesty and sensitivity during the dating process. I know that turning down a shidduch or ending the dating can be painful. I dont' think it makes it less painful when it's the shadchan who delivers the blow.
(1/16/2014 11:49:33 PM)
17
Mother
I met a Lakewood shadchan recently and couldn't believe what he told me. The poorest clients give a minimum of $2000 each side for a shidduch and the price goes all the way up to $10,000 each side. He says the average pay in Williamsburg is $5,000 each side. Maybe if people paid more in Crown Heights...
(1/16/2014 11:53:46 PM)
18
the parents
if the parents will not be so picky and allow us to date even if its not so to there like because we really don't care what your friends will say or attitude then we will marry faster
(1/16/2014 11:59:01 PM)
19
Happy new mother-in-law
chabadmatch.com!
It worked for us.
(1/17/2014 12:02:27 AM)
20
aboslute solution
I am a lubavitcher from a originally frum boro park style family. My sister recently got married - each side gave $3,000 shadchanus.
The normal range is $2000 - $3000 each side.
I think that would aolve all the issues.
(1/17/2014 12:08:16 AM)
21
It already takes place in Israel
you feel out a survey
and according to your answers it filters through all the people in your community/group/style/hashkafa and you just try each one. simple.
(1/17/2014 12:18:51 AM)
22
I've been saying this for a long time!
And to 17, u think there is no shidduch problems in Lakewood lol
(1/17/2014 12:30:02 AM)
23
Number 12
You are quite the imbecile. Besides the fact in which your grammar skills are poorly lacking the problem is you don't emphasize a point. Just wanted to call you out on the fact that you and your husband are gheiza - honestly no one gives a flying flip. I'll hope and pray for you to gain some wisdom and oh yeah, language skills!
(1/17/2014 12:32:52 AM)
24
mazal Tov
there seems to be enough money for lechaims with fancy cookies and cupcakes that is good for show and tell only!Perhaps this money should rather be invested in getting the shidduch. money talks......
(1/17/2014 12:33:51 AM)
25
russian
please dont convince yourselves that in russia all shiduchim were through a third party even the most chassidishe yidden.
(1/17/2014 12:36:36 AM)
26
Response
To 12: I like that!!

To 17: Excuse me?!?!
(1/17/2014 12:48:30 AM)
27
no. 18
u hit the nail on the head
(1/17/2014 1:06:19 AM)
28
to number 9
why not share the this amazing site?
(1/17/2014 1:21:55 AM)
29
$$?? So if I come from a large fam w no $= no shiduch?!
Seriously more money?! Ppl are going to marry off their kids now! Do u have any idea how much that costs? I'm glad that in boro park they pay 100 thousand a shiduch maybe they poop money I sure as hell don't!


As for the Shadchanim... I went to them... I paid them to see my pretty face and then when I called him he said "I'm working on it" when we met him on kingstone he said "I'm working on it" and now mr ... it's been over a year and we haven't gotten one name out of you! I'm sure your still working on it! Lemme tell you something... I AM TOO!!!
(1/17/2014 1:38:03 AM)
30
Pay the Shadchan !!!
Most people in crown heights don't pay enough the Shadchan unlike other communities its a hard job and people don't appreciate it first they all sound desperate once they ge engaged they forget the Shadchan !!!!
(1/17/2014 2:22:08 AM)
31
Self confidence.
It's time for people to come out to the light and stop hiding behind shadchanim. Don't completely rely on them to go out, look for you, and find you the right one. (That's giving them too much responsibility). Take matters into your own hands. Everyone one knows a friends sister, or a cousins friend, or friends cousin. Yes, even BT's. I know that it sounds a little "outlandish" but muster up the courage to tell someone about your idea for a shidduch, a parent, friend, or even a shadchan. Or take a deep breath and go over to her yourself. Your not that bad, she might actually want to get to know you!!!! This is for the younger, single, MAINSTREAM, chabd population. "It's time to take matters into our own hands"!!!!
(1/17/2014 2:27:44 AM)
32
Not a bad idea
How about we let singles sift through prospective anonymous profiles and when two people approve each others profiles the shadchan can be alerted and phone numbers and names can be released.
23- you are in no position to critique others on their English grammar.
(1/17/2014 2:50:56 AM)
33
Anonymous
It is time for lubavitch to understand that there is no need ito waste thousands of dollars for lechaim .
So many families are struggling
So many shlouchim are struggling
So many young couples are having a hard time
(1/17/2014 3:08:11 AM)
34
Do something about it!
Create this organization! Help yourself and may you have lots of hatzlacha
(1/17/2014 3:08:35 AM)
35
I like what 12 said...
I have half a mind to do something similar, at least in the sense of taking matters into my own hands and being bold about it, as opposed to thinking that my destiny lies in the hands of some shadchan. But I still see the value in doing things the stamdard way, if it can work for you.
(1/17/2014 3:19:59 AM)
36
to #23
Your grammar skills aren't that great, either. And I'm NOT #12. As we say over here - al rosh haganav bo'er hakova...
(I didn't read #12's comment but your comment, commenting - in bad grammar - about someone else's bad grammar was just too much.)
(1/17/2014 3:54:33 AM)
37
Hey #12
Kind of funny that your chassidishe husband noticed your eyes, don't you think?
We didn't meet through a shidduch, either, but that doesn't mean I publicize how, and when I do tell, I'm not as proud of it as you sound.
(1/17/2014 3:56:38 AM)
38
good idea
This idea is 100% correct. If it were a real business the results would be much greater.
I know shadcahanim who are begged for a shidduch and after they do hard work even many rich people give them nothing!!! nada!!! zilch !!!
Sooooo make it a real business with real incentives and it will work.
(1/17/2014 5:27:22 AM)
39
DISGUSTED!!
YES NEED A BIG CHANGE IN THIS HORRIBLE SYSTEM OF SHIDDUCHIM, THOSE SHADCHANITES ARE ONLY DOING FOR THEIR FAMILIES AND FRIENDS AND OTHERS YOU GOT TO PUT YR BIG $ DOWN, WHAT A SHAME.
SORRY DONT NEED A COMPUTER TO DO SHIDDUCHIM BUT GOOD HEARTED AND DEVOTED PEOPLE SPECIALLY IN CROWN HEIGHTS???
CHANGE YOUR SYSTEM LETS OUR YOUNG PEOPLE TO MEET EACH OTHER, TIME CAME TO CHANGE !!
(1/17/2014 6:35:18 AM)
40
Reality
Most shidduchim are NOT made throug shadchanim
#8 I agree. we need a new alternative parents networking
I don't agree with OP idea completely because disclosure iof private issues but obviously is going to improve at least something current situation
(1/17/2014 7:45:22 AM)
41
Excellent, excellent idea!
This is idea is excellent and needed. Here are a few suggestions:
1. A Gvir should be approached for seed money, $100,000 to acquire offices and staff
2. Grants should be sought after, to keep this agency goingi
3. It should be incorporated, and should have non profit status
4. It should be somewhere on Kingston, on a second level
5. Only the very best in staff should be hired
6. This is so important, that a full blown fundraising campaign should be started ASAP.
7. This idea can work and if the right people get involved, it can be unbelievably successful.
Kol HaKavod!!
(1/17/2014 7:58:22 AM)
42
Empire Blvd & NY Av 11225
Time to change the paradigm . In the upper non Jewish class, I am referring to "society" they also want their children to marry "well". They have something called a debutante ball.

(1/17/2014 8:18:23 AM)
43
Speed dating?
Guys. What's your opinion of a kosher frum speed dating?
(1/17/2014 8:35:28 AM)
44
to #9
What is the site called??
(1/17/2014 8:45:56 AM)
45
I agree
This is a good idea.
Much better than an online site.
Shadchanim NEED to meet with the young men and women face to face to get a feel for who they are and what they're all about.
(1/17/2014 8:47:41 AM)
46
No 12
The natural pull that 2 halves of one soul feel when meeting - even randomly, has not changed one bit since the beginning of time. The fact that a boy has the courage and strength to act on that feeling truly shows what he is made of. Guaranteed , he is a go - getter and a person who is unafraid. I only wish that so many other boys had the strength of character to go after what they want. If they know who the girl is the. they can ask a shadchan to pursue it, but if they don't, why is an introduction so horrible? Every single girl in the world wants to feel wanted and pursued. That kind of action should last for the entire marriage!

I have been to many Shabbos tables where there are singles, and they seem to make a sincere effort to NOT show any interest :(

Perhaps there can be events where only VERY serious people can come , and you cannot leave without choosing a date. Filtering out the non serious ones will be a big help. This problem is EXACTLY the same for the chassidish to the less so.
Best of luck! Let's hope this discussion leads to many great happy marriages :)
(1/17/2014 9:01:44 AM)
47
to12#
That is not chasidish and hipuch hatznius

I dont want bochurim walking over to my daughter at 19 and telling her her eyes are cute?!
(1/17/2014 9:05:22 AM)
48
opportunity
Yes, maybe this is a good idea in that shidduchim should be a business. But what I'm finding, as I'm just trying to help and make some shidduchim, is that:
A. Parents aren't in touch with who their children are
B. Setting geographical limits on where a potential suitor can come from (" Not from Australia")
These two issues seem to block shidduchim from happening.
(1/17/2014 9:05:33 AM)
49
response
i couldnt agree with #48 more! so many parents look into shidduchim based on themselves and the image they have to keep up. If parents would actually do what is in the best interest for their child ( not their image) we might not be in this crisis!
(1/17/2014 9:15:28 AM)
50
unknown
We all need to work on our Emunas Hashem and bitochon BaHashem when it comes to shidduchim. Worry is not the answer because the word for worry is DeAka in Hebrew. The Bais is missing in that word. So now you know what we need!! Shidduchim is as hard as kriyas Yam Suf as we know only Hashem did it. Hashem knows what we all need & no one else (as they think they know). Money is not the issue to pay for to get a shidduch. Hashem will reward us for each shidduch made. Moshiach will reveal itself, Mamush, if we will focus solely on the belief in Hashem .
(1/17/2014 9:15:32 AM)
51
another idea
Have you heard of chabadmatch.com?
(1/17/2014 9:21:53 AM)
52
Where do our loyalties lie?
It is time we realized that spending thousands on l'chaims is not necessary. If everyone would have this awareness, there wouldn't be a fear of "what my friends will think" if people had modest l'chaims. All that money could be spent on something much more useful, say shadchanim. An engagement is not a wedding! That's what it seems like these days.

Good job, and good luck Shaindel and Chani! And to number 7: It WILL work if it is managed well, and not begun with preconceived notions of its failure.
(1/17/2014 9:27:35 AM)
53
Get friends involved
And if you don't want to date an Aussie, you're missing out!
(1/17/2014 9:37:52 AM)
54
disagree
unless you two have computers in your kitchen, you better have a good excuse for leaving the kitchen
(1/17/2014 9:51:01 AM)
55
to 12
just because your happy now with the results doesnt make this ok, up to our standards., and is certainly not a 'better' approach chas vshalom...for many reasons... speak to your mashpia and she can explain to you why this is not the best way...and who wants to settle for not the best in such an important area of our lives...?
this is a sensitive topic but please dont give others the go-ahead to do something completely inapropriate.
(1/17/2014 9:51:16 AM)
56
Core Value
Even if you aren't so frum or "chassidishe" for the sake of your sisters and brothers, dress Jewishly. I'm referring to the fact that calling attention to ourselves creates an atmosphere of competition and even jealousy, G-d forbid. So, even if you wouldn't be so inclined for your own sake--do it for the sakes of your sisters and brothers, fellow Jews. Maybe it's counterintuitive to a mindset that focuses on externalities. But for a Jewish soul, it's core.
(1/17/2014 9:52:00 AM)
57
Shadchonim
They are mostly a waste of time. all they want is your $$$, they will throw names at you just because maybe you will get lucky.

Have a friend or family member set you up and your chances of it working will be 85% better than with a Shadchon.
(1/17/2014 9:56:26 AM)
58
MyShidduch.net
There was a nice comment above I think about my site. I tried the proposed idea a few years ago as I had the same one. B"H it's going well with many Mazel Tovs, but the more singles we have, the better it will be. We have a lot more girls than Bochurim joining... It's free to join, and privacy and respect for all singles are our #1 priorities. Please join today at MyShidduch.net and spread the word!
(1/17/2014 10:22:22 AM)
59
A lot of good ideas, please let's do something
There are so many good ideas and useful comments here. I am a mother of an exceptional girl. The frustration that we feel just keeps mounting.

The op-ed writers have suggested something that is absolutely essential for our community. This idea has been done by Klausenberg and it has worked. People have been suggesting this for awhile. We have to go to this next step, and what the person who posted about all the categories--bronze copper, silver, gold, platinum, and diamond-- this is definitely what is preventing so many shidduchim from even being suggested. There is no thinking outside the box, yet our community is so outside of the box.

I have a friend who is a shadchaniste in Boro Park. She always tells me that Lubavitch is not like the other Chassidishe groups when it comes to shadchanim. She compares us to the Litvishe. She complains that Lubavitchers seem to feel that no one is good enough for them. They find something wrong with everyone. Does that sound familiar?

While it is true that everyone should try to make shidduchim for people that they know, and everyone can suggest and make shidduchim, the time has come to establish an organization.

Quite a number of years ago there was an emergency meeting at the JCM. Rabbi Groner and other shadchanim spoke and it was attended by hundreds of parents. It's time we call such an emergency meeting and commit to a project like this asap. If a 100 people gave a $1000 you have a $100K right there. I alone, one person, have given shadchanim about $1000 just for all the registration fees.
Can we do something please?

Lubavitch is bursting with talent and energy. Maybe a network of young people should be enlisted for this along with some of the regular shadchanim. There's nothing better when a person who knows both sides makes the shidduch, and the young people know their peers better than anyone.

Of course, everyone needs to daven, but we have to roll up our sleeves too.
(1/17/2014 10:50:45 AM)
60
Then Why....
I don't want to spend thousands on a lchaim and I'm sure some would agree.... Why are the halls so expensive to rent?!? There are so many engagements k'ah - lots of lchaims - that I'm sure many halls (ULY, JCM) can afford to lower their costs! A Bris doesn't have to cost $850 for the hall alone!!!!!!!!!
WHY??????
(1/17/2014 11:08:47 AM)
61
to 17
I think 12 was just trying to emphasize how despite there being
Regular chabad in every way and even being gezhe!! which brings out that they were coming from a very chabad background. they were nonetheless able to make a chasidishe
Shidduch without the use of the archaic system still in place.

Excuse my grammar the same archaic system never taught me
English
(1/17/2014 11:22:16 AM)
62
who needs a shadchan
pull your sleeves up find a girl ask her out and thats it shalom al yisroel the whole shadchan business is really getting out of hand!!
(1/17/2014 11:40:03 AM)
63
Number 14 - daven!
I only read the first few comments
Number 14 has a good point
(1/17/2014 1:02:40 PM)
64
pick oneperson
If every couple would concentrate on just one person they would surely be able to make at least one shidduch. If you are concentrating on a girl then invite single guys for Shabbos make friends with them and you will be able to marry off this girl and vice versa. This is not rocket science. People respond to enthusiastic suggestions. So if you know a single girl or boy well and you get to know others of the opposite gender that might work you will be ahead of the game. It helps to know the parents of both sides well and have their respect. If everyone would look out for just one single we would make great headway in getting our children married
(1/17/2014 2:02:48 PM)
65
46??
Maybe we should make frum nightclubs...?
(1/17/2014 2:59:09 PM)
66
Shadchanim's Fee! Way too low!
I have a son who is in need of a Shidduch, and although I have a regular job $55,000 gross a year, and I will need help financially for the wedding. I have made three weddings, B"H, and it cost me $25-30K, and that's cheap! With the minimum expenses. Don't get me wrong, I cannot afford the amount that I am presnting in this public letter, however, I come from a mixed Chassidisher background, which are onlty too happy to pay $5000.00 EACH side for a Shadchan. Point being, My wife and I have paid $180.00 deposit, $100.00 deposit to Shachanim/Shadchantes, and NO RESULTS. I called many family members in Monsey, Boro Park, an Williamsburg (Even the Sephardic Community) and ALL Shadchanim get paid between 3000, and 5000 dollars a side. Yes, it's alot of money, and I'm sure they are working very hard for it. But, there is results, followups, and full dedication and off course drive for the Shadchanim to make the Shidduch. Here in Crown Heights, The Shadchan, may receive $500-$1000, if they are lucky. So, the results are sketchy, at best! They have told me "What I should drop everything, to concentrate on your son?" I understand that answer... It's VERY tough to make a Shidduch, and the financial benefits, are at best case, mediocre. I am willing to pay more, even though tough. You'll see immediate results from them, and a powerful reason for them to be constantly active in looking for a Shidduch for your child. The exact amount should be spelled out before Shidduch starts, and the fee could be - between $3500-$5000, depending on the situation.

Good Shabbos.

(I perfer not to give my name)
(1/17/2014 3:01:11 PM)
67
not feasible for many
Paying so much to shadchanim is not feasible these days for many people and if shadchanim only work well when paid, then many people will be left behind. Besides if you pay upfront for a shadchan and they never make your shidduch it is very frustrating. I dont agree paying is the answer. Or if people are to be paid, it would be good to have a wealthy person sponsor the idea, or many wealthy people, who would pay for shadchanim to sit all day and look for shidduchim. that might work. but not that parents have to pay such prices. I know people who have paid money upfront but did not find a shidduch through that shadchan. I dont think the problem is money. I think the problem is that there are not shadchanim who actually work at this full time (and even if paid they may not work at it full time as they may have other jobs etc.) The better idea is to set up a system sponsored by wealthy people who do pay for someone to work, as a job, simply making shidduchim all day. That might work. . But I dont think the answer is to overburden parents more. Not in today's society.
(1/17/2014 3:21:03 PM)
68
Pleeeease...
and you will be able to marry off this girl and vice versa. This is not rocket science. People respond to enthusiastic suggestions. So if you know a single girl or boy well and you get to know others of the opposite gender that might work you will be ahead of the game. It helps to know the parents of both sides well and have their respect. If everyone would look out for just one single we would make great headway in getting our children marriedRegular chabad in every way and even being gezhe!! which brings out that they were coming from a very chabad background. they were nonetheless able to make a chasidishe
Shidduch without the use of the archaic system still in place.She always tells me that Lubavitch is not like the other Chassidishe groups when it comes to shadchanim. She compares us to the Litvishe. She complains that Lubavitchers seem to feel that no one is good enough for them. They find something wrong with everyone. Does that sound familiar?

While it is true that everyone should try to make shidduchim for people that they know, and everyone can suggest and make shidduchim, the time has come to establish an organization.

Quite a number of years ago there was an emergency meeting at the JCM. Rabbi Groner and other shadchanim spoke and it was attended by hundreds of parents. It's time we call such an emergency meeting and commit to a project like this asap. If a 100 people gave a $1000 you have a $100K right there. I alone, one person, although I have a regular job $55,000 gross a year, and I will need help financially for the wedding. I have made three weddings, B"H, and it cost me $25-30K, and that's cheap! With the minimum expenses. Don't get me wrong, I cannot afford the amount that I am presnting in this public letter, however, I come from a mixed Chassidisher background, which are onlty too happy to pay $5000.00 EACH side for a Shadchan. Point being, My wife and I have paid $180.00 deposit, $100.00 deposit to Shachanim/Shadchantes, and NO RESULTS. I called many family members in Monsey, Boro Park, an Williamsburg (Even the Sephardic Community) and ALL Shadchanim get paid between 3000, and 5000 dollars a side. Yes, it's alot of money, and I'm sure they are working very hard for it. But, there is results, followups, and full dedication and off course drive for the Shadchanim to make the Shidduch. Here in Crown Heights, The Shadchan, may receive $500-$1000, if they are lucky. So, the results are sketchy, at best! They have told me "What I should drop everything, to concentrate on your son?" I understand that answer... It's VERY tough to make a Shidduch, and the financial benefits, are at best case, mediocre. I am willing to pay more, even though tough. You'll see immediate results from them, and a powerful reason for them to be constantly active in looking for a Shidduch for your child. I am a mother of an exceptional girl. The frustration that we feel just keeps mounting.

The op-ed writers have suggested something that is absolutely essential for our community. This idea has been done by Klausenberg and it has worked. People have been suggesting this for awhile. We have to go to this next step, and what the person who posted about all the categories--bronze copper, silver, gold, platinum, and diamond-- this is definitely what is preventing so many shidduchim from even being suggested. There is no thinking outside the box, yet our community is so outside of the box.

I have a friend who is a shadchaniste in Boro Park. She always tells me that Lubavitch is not like the other Chassidishe groups when it comes to shadchanim. She compares us to the Litvishe. She complains that Lubavitchers seem to feel that no one is good enough for them. They find something wrong with everyone. Does that sound familiar?

While it is true that everyone should try to make shidduchim for people that they know, and everyone can suggest and make shidduchim, the time has come to establish an organization.

Quite a number of years ago there was an emergency meeting at the JCM. Rabbi Groner and other shadchanim spoke and it was attended by hundreds of parents. It's time we call such an emergency meeting and commit to a project like this asap. If a 100 people gave a $1000 you have a $100K right there. I alone, one person, have given shadchanim about $1000 just for all the registration fees.
(1/17/2014 3:32:30 PM)
69
I agree with #64
Friends is simply the best way to go about it.

Comment # 65 may be a good idea too.

They should also have those mixed shabbos meals more often. I don't see them posted frequently enough...
(1/17/2014 3:34:20 PM)
70
Agree with #66 PAY MORE TO SHADCHANIM!
Yes, there are a number of Shidduchim made through friends and families. the problem is the other set of people, who don't Have family and friends, well connected, those people SHOULD cough up the SAME amount of dough 3000 to 5000k for a Shidduch, JUST LIKE the majority of Chassidisher communities. THAT'S WAY THEY DON'T HAVE A MAJOR ISSUE WITH THE SHIDDUCH CRISES. We are CHEAP, and do not appreciate our Shadchanim through the accepted $ amount! - The wedding day cost all parties involved (50,000K), what is so wrong paying the Shadchan less than 10%?????????

(the Chassidisher world has already accepted that fee) WHY do we (Chabadnik's) try to change that?

(1/17/2014 4:30:51 PM)
71
12
How chasssidish can u be if u walked over to a strange girl and told her how nice her eyes are also gezea usually means a lubavitcher peasant from nevel , nothing to show off about
(1/17/2014 4:38:50 PM)
72
#16 Said it best
Don't rely on shadchanim. Take action yourself. My father, who is not an official shadchan, made 5 shiduchim over the years just by suggesting names directly to the parents, without any shadchanim involved. This is getting back to basics, and this is the way it will get fixed.

Simple. You hear of a guy who may be good for a girl, make some calls to see if it makes some sense and then pass the name directly to the parents.
(1/17/2014 6:47:09 PM)
73
thanking the shadchan = excellent service
We have had excellent service from our shadchanim.
Why?
1) we don't expect them to find every name - we ask high and low for names that might be shayach - people that know our child, etc. the shadchan might come up with a name, but we also give names to the shadchan to call / email the parents to see if they are interested in swapping profiles
2) we pay a small gift to the shadchan for EVERY shidduch our child dates. after all, the shadchan did work, they spent hours calling and emailing and getting back to us and figuring out how to present things in a menchlich way for us. even if it didn't work out, the shadchan deserves a well earned reward!

when shadchanim are treated this way - believe me, they give great service! And it is a pleasant experience. For all our shiduchim so far, the suggestions came from friends of our child. But when we called the shadchan, we got immediate excellent service to do their work with the name because they KNEW we would appreciate their efforts. They called right away, got back to us in a timely manner, were great advocates for us and were also truly b'simcha when the real shidduch came along!

People who think it is unfair to pay money before its the real one are missing the point. The shadchan spent time working to help you marry off your child! Is that not holy work? Shouldn't you show some gratitude? We didn't pay a fortune, but a decent gift according to our means.

Many holy Jews and I believe our Rebbeim had this practice of paying for every successful suggestion. I know doing so has made us appreciate their work much more! And for sure the shadchan takes us more seriously because we thank them, give gifts and appreciate their efforts! Each time I call, they call back!!!!!!!

btw - with shadchanus gelt, if the shadchan is not the suggester of the name, the halacha is that 2/3 goes to the shadchan and 1/3 to the suggester that made it happen. Please consult your own Rav if the situation arises.
(1/18/2014 7:57:59 AM)
74
Slightly new perspective?
Anyone ever bothered asking any of their newlywed friends to assist?
Obviously once they are married they are busy, but why can't they be helping their still single friends?
They were just in the system and are the right age, plus it would be a lot easier as their wife/husband would know most of the people they are trying to look for who would in all likelihood be their friends.
Surely newlyweds don't overnight become the busiest people in the world!
Re shadchanim... obviously many of them do a good job, but many tell the boy/girl and their parents to find the name and do all the work, including finding out if it is suitable. Often the boy/girl they are looking into is not even interested, and this is only discovered once an approach has been made.
This is absolutely ridiculous and unfortunately many boys/girls lose faith in the system...

In short, friends (ESPECIALLY ENGAGED & NEWLYWEDS ) must help their peers.
Unfortunately, this help is almost non-existent in many places...
(1/18/2014 11:01:47 AM)
75
#12 did have a shadchante
Her name is 'Lieba' and many of her matches are not viable, because mind should come before heart. Heart is extremely important but the foundation has to make sense.
(1/18/2014 5:13:59 PM)
76
Show me the money!
Who does the author suggest should pay for all this?
(1/18/2014 7:37:59 PM)
77
$180 ,that's it????
I'm shocked!!!! You only pay 180 and you expect someone to spend hours upon hours helping with your profile, checking out potential prospects who (they or their parents) may reject you, the amount of time spent with following up, and dates that don't go anywhere - and you only pay $180????!!! The system absolutely needs revamping and its starts with paying reputable shadchanim salaries that they can devote their time accordingly. Same with paying only $1000 if successful. Covers a fraction of the time spent finding someone a shidduch. No one forces anyone to use a shadchan. Obviously shadchanim are needed. Don't abuse them or underestimate thier worth.
(1/18/2014 8:07:02 PM)
78
Shidduchim not a priority in Crown Heights
Sorry folks being a shadchan is not a priority in Crown Heights. i have heard all their lame excuses

awhile ago i Kiryat Sanz in Israel the Kausenberger Rebbe was approached because they were having a shidduch crisis so the Rebbe decided the following.: make an organization call it such and such a name ., take the more prominent folks who really deal in shadchonis and pay them $5,000 -$50,000 for each shidduch depending on how much went into it. What ever jobs these folks held before they would have to leave and just do shadchonis. A committee of business men would have to be formed to raise alot of money to help fund this group of shadchonim so they would be able to do their work. also not everyone could pay such large sums so all bases would be covered. Guess what. They dont have a crisis anymore!!
(1/18/2014 9:13:04 PM)
79
agreed
Like yeshivah needs young blood teaching the shiduchim need new people


(1/18/2014 9:28:13 PM)
80
shidduchim
If this ever works out, I would love to come work for you!
(1/18/2014 9:36:55 PM)
81
Response to #58
You did an amazing thing by putting together myshidduch.net however, it is pretty useless at this point because it is not regularly updated! Many of the profiles on the site appear to have been posted over a year ago and not updated! I have seen some profiles on there of people who are married.
(1/18/2014 10:45:56 PM)
82
check
check into Lakewood, they have such a set-up
(1/18/2014 10:50:11 PM)
83
I am #12
Wow a friend told me their are so many responses to my story. Well yes I asked my mashpia and she said the fact that he came over to you and did something that is not the official derech should have nothing to do with me if I respect him for what is inportant in my chasideshe and general life he should has his mashpia if what he is doing is the right derech to find his Shiduch. However by that time we both realized that we are for each other and so he dident have to ask as what is done is done for the good!!
Now me as a mashpia my self I would say the same thing and even more! Who are we to say what is a correct way or not if it's done in a nice respectable pleasant manner ? I realized he wasn't playing around !!! He looked like a nice frum and real chasidishe guy that I would see my self on a date with and I realized after he was very much for me and thank him for taking it into his Own hands and do what he did!
Hatzlocho to the next FRUM guy or girl that approaches their prospect on Kingston!!
(1/19/2014 12:45:18 AM)
84
paying up front and getting nowhere
There are now a number of shadchanim who charge an up front fee and, while I don't blame them, they don't guarantee anything. If they don't have anyone to recommend, they won't go out of their way to find that person. It is basically a registration fee. They may or may not do anything for the person who pays other than to register that person in their books.
There used to be someone working through the community council that was doing shidduchim as a service to the community but I don't know if that is still happening. Some of the websites were popular when they started but the popularity has waned.
While it makes sense to pay a higher shadchanus fee to get shadchanum to want to put in the time and effort, those huge fees are daunting to the many who are poor and who turn to the community for help making their chassunahs. This is where rabbonim need to pasken because if a person seeks the help of a shadchan, the halacha is to pay the going rate of shadchanus. The question is, what can a person do halachically if they want to find a shidduch but cannot afford a shadchan. There does not seem to be halachic objection to finding a shidduch online and more and more people today are inviting mixed singles to Shabbos meals in order to facilitate shidduchim.
Obviously, if the OP's suggestion would ever work, people would have to agree to pay a certain amount up front, a certain amount for every new introduction that did not work out, and a certain amount for shadchanus when a shidduch did work out.
It would be great of our rabbonim would speak out about the subject of shadchanus gelt and halachically permissible ways to find shidduchim for those who cannot afford the gelt and the steep up-front fees.
(1/19/2014 12:52:35 AM)
85
Shiduch crisis ...
Shiduch crisis is not because of shadchanim are not working . It's because our standards for potential Hassan or Kala are different nowdays ...
Hassan has to be rich and with growing future potencial and Kalah has to be beautiful , with a good dowry and at least B.A....
Many girls has B.A. today and well paid so they are looking for the right guys that also have a degree and well paid , but do we have enough bohrim to meet this standards ... My answer is No ... That's why in my opinion the crisis ...
So open your eyes and invest in Good Chinuh for Guys that can be rich , because to have a family today you must be rich or at least to have proper education to get well paid job ...
(1/19/2014 1:49:17 AM)
86
DR, LAWYER, TEACHER, LANDLORD
If you dont get paid you go to court or bais din
but u have no shame giving a shadchan bubkes

you cry for a shidduch promise the world and than give pennies

A real payment system and than the incentive will be there and you will see many more hard working and successful matchmakers.
MAZAL TOV!!!!!
(1/19/2014 5:23:50 AM)
87
"New" Shidduch System needed!
That's the title. I do agree with a new system, and would like to remind everyone, that a new system was almost in place, many years ago. A. Rabbi Laizer Avtzon proposed to a number of Balei Batim to have this EXACT system in place, and even made a financial plan for it (can produce documents, with permission.) B. Tzivos HaShem had 6 years ago together with ChabadMatch.com, (which have only produced a mere 300 Shidduchim, although that sounds great, it is a far cry short of the 1000s of Shidduchim still needed today), ran in the old Tzivos HaShem building the same new system we are all talking about. "Run it like a business", I can only guess why these two great attempts where not successful, because - not enough money to run it - Not an emergency - Etc. Thank you COL LIVE, for bringing it back to the forefront, and just maybe, MAYBE, this time around it will be taking a more serious a direct approach to the implementation for a new (old) system to be finally successful!
(1/19/2014 1:32:54 PM)
88
won't work ...
nobody will want a whole agency to know that their kids are dating !! its not gonna work ....
(1/19/2014 2:56:12 PM)
89
Great idea!
To 88, with a little thought it could be private the same way myshidduch.net has a numbers system. I have thought of this idea before and would like i to be actualized before I marry off my kids!! Worked with 100's of Shaddchanim that are not completely affiliated and in sync with each other in inefficient
(1/19/2014 4:38:49 PM)
90
RABBI MANIS FREIDMAN IS HAVING A CALL NOW ON THIS AND PEOPLE SHOULD LISTEN TO IT. I THINK WE ARE FORGETTING WHO MAKES THE SHIDDUCH , HASHEM IS THE ONE WHO IS MAKING THE SHIDDUCH NOT THE SHADCHANIM.
(1/19/2014 6:29:54 PM)
91
Love these articles....
Pure entertainment :)

A girl 'in the system'
(1/19/2014 6:53:07 PM)
92
Chabadmatch
The site worked for us, and it was easy to work with Shadchanim, binging them suggestions that looked shayach.
(1/20/2014 7:05:14 AM)
93
Goodbye shadchanim
It's time to get shadchanim out of the picture. Let boys and girls meet, socially, in safe and trusted environment, a contemporary take on 15th Av. The sooner we remove parents as unrealistic gatekeepers and shadchanim as the toll booth collectors, the better. if we trust our children our old enough to get married and start a real relationship with a spouse, then we must also assume that they are old enough to figure out who to marry.
(1/20/2014 9:43:20 AM)
94
RateAShadchan.com
So who wants to create RateAShadchan.com? I'd like to see stats on fees, response times, number of suggestions made, appropriateness of suggestions, number of marriages made, and most importantly, number of couples that stayed married! Now THAT would make it easier to pick a shadchan and to figure out what to pay them.
(1/20/2014 9:45:11 AM)
95
@24
Do we want our children marrying to someone just because we can offer more money

Back in the shtetel if you had more money you got a better bochur whether he was good for you or not
(1/21/2014 1:40:36 AM)
96
There's another website
It's called zivugzone.???
They claim to have a great success rate
(1/21/2014 2:04:39 AM)
97
Best Method!
Talk to everyone you know! Networking is the best way to meet is through friends, relatives, etc. This is true for the non-Jewish world as well!
(1/22/2014 11:19:26 AM)
98
the only problem
is who is going to be staffing this huge office and doing all these great secretarial jobs and coordinating it.

because as a working single girl with working single frineds, i can tell you that the organization and actual functioning of any institution in crown heights is due to the SINGLES.

if you can only get married people to staff this agency, a) you won't find that many b) they won't have that much time.
(1/22/2014 5:10:55 PM)
99
Age-Gap The only problem & the only answer
The problem of Lakewood & Lubavitch (At least one thing in common) is the age gap. Boruch Hashem there is population increase. Lets take a low # of 5% & easy figure.When 1000 babies are born this year ,1050 next year ,1100 ,1150 1200, & on. In Litvish & Lubavitch communities the boys start shidduchim at 23 & the girls start at 19.That translates to 1000 boys have 1200 girls to choose from. The best shadchen network can only do 1000 shidduchim .The U.S. census states that there are 5% more boys than girls born every year. This reduces the crisis to 1000 boys have 1150 girls to choose from. Now there are 5% that listen to halacha & daas torah to marry younger and same age. Net result R"L 10% of the girls never get married. This is why there was a Kol Koira of Lubavitch rabonim, & a year ago a Kol Koira of 50 Rabonim and Rosha Yeshivos. that boys should start shidduchim earlier. Therefore start redding shidduchim to the young ones for the young ones.& warn the parents to stop this 23 to 19 business before it hits them. Every 10 boys saying that they will only start listening after 23 are the cause of one girl to stay an Aguna for ever. This system must stop. When we get the young for the young, The 23 yaer old (+) boys will have to take the 23(+) year old girls.
The Chasidim (other than Lubavitch) have a reverse problem. The boys & the girls land on Shidduch Island all at age 18 .Since 5% more boys r born yearly they have no old girls .If anything they have old boys. To them the answer would be boys should start @ 18 and a half & girls at 17 and a half. (I heard that Belz started this now).
In the mean time intermarriage of of Lakewood or Lubavitch girls should consider Chasidic boys. & Chasidic boys should consider Litvish girls.
The Ultimate goal should that no one stays single . Not to be smarter than Chazal & Halacha. They said thousands of years ago that a boy is mature to get married at 18 to 20.They said this before technology & before the Yaitzer Hora was at the finger tips. This system of "monkey see monkey do" and boys starting shidduchim @ 23 must stop. Lman Bnos Lisroel
(1/25/2014 8:51:41 PM)
100
Dancing In the Fields at Tu B'Av and Yom Kippur
The two holiest and most auspicious times in the year for women of pure hearts to attain the honor of receiving their spiritual 'bashert' other half are Tu B'Av and Yom Kippur. Once women worship Hashem in spirit and truth by thanking Him openly for His agricultural Providence by participating in the grape harvest (or its modern day equivalent) on its first and last days of the season, they will have a better chance of being chosen by their bashert, a man who will also be in the fields at these same festivals, thanking Hashem for His Providence of a future wife.
(2/12/2014 1:45:07 PM)
101
not the system but the shadchanim themselves
I don't blame the game, nor do I blame the players, I blame the referees. Stop putting such emphasis on yichus b/c your yichus is worthless if you are a baal gaava.
(8/24/2014 7:58:05 PM)
102
TO NUMBER 73
RE number 73. I'm a former shadchan. Although your efforts are more than most, what's bothering me is that for every name you suggest to the shadchan, you only invest money if there is an actual date from their efforts. What about all the effort put in if the end result is NO. If your so generous, you would gladly offer that. Its easy to throw a name and dangle the carrot if a potencial date comes of it. Sorry not impressed. You have only gotten this "great" service b/c most ppl do a lot less. I see right through it and it wouldn't have worked with me
(7/7/2015 11:45:51 PM)
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